DEPARTMENT NO. 103 HON. LANCE A. ITO, JUDGE

APPEARANCES: (APPEARANCES AS HERETOFORE NOTED, MR. DARDEN NOT BEING PRESENT.)

(JANET M. MOXHAM, CSR NO. 4855, OFFICIAL REPORTER.)

(CHRISTINE M. OLSON, CSR NO. 2378, OFFICIAL REPORTER.)

(PAGES 20704 THROUGH 20713, VOLUME 116A, TRANSCRIBED AND SEALED UNDER SEPARATE COVER.)

(THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT, OUT OF THE PRESENCE OF THE JURY:)

(A CONFERENCE WAS HELD AT THE BENCH, NOT REPORTED.)

(THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT:)

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. COUNSEL, LET'S PROCEED. LET'S PROCEED.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

THE COURT: LET'S GET THE AUDIENCE AND GO FORWARD.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

THE COURT: BACK ON THE RECORD IN THE SIMPSON MATTER. THE DEFENDANT IS AGAIN PRESENT BEFORE THE COURT WITH HIS COUNSEL, MR. SHAPIRO, MR. COCHRAN, MR. DOUGLAS, MR. BAILEY. THE PEOPLE ARE REPRESENTED BY MISS CLARK. WHAT HAPPENED TO MR. DARDEN? ALL RIGHT. MR. DOUGLAS, MISS CLARK, YOU HAD A MATTER YOU WANTED TO TAKE UP BEFORE WE RESUME WITH THE JURY?

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN DEFENSE COUNSEL.)

MS. CLARK: YES. (DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY AND DEFENSE COUNSEL.)

MS. CLARK: YES, YOUR HONOR. WE ARE GOING TO BE STIPULATING TO THE ADMISSIBILITY OF THE CELL PHONE RECORDS THAT WERE SUBPOENAED FROM AIR TOUCH, BUT THE STIPULATION THAT WAS PREVIOUSLY FRAMED NEEDS TO BE REWORKED A LITTLE BIT AND THEN WE WILL PRESENT THAT TO THE COURT. AND I WANTED TO INDICATE TO COUNSEL THAT BEFORE I WAS LOOKING FOR A CLEAN COPY OF THE PHONE RECORDS FOR THE LIMO AND I NOW HAVE THEM AND I WOULD LIKE TO SUBMIT THESE RECORDS IN LIEU OF THE ONES PREVIOUSLY GIVEN, WHICH HAD MARKINGS ON THEM.

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. THAT WAS PEOPLE'S EXHIBIT?

MS. CLARK: 148.

THE COURT: MRS. ROBERTSON, PEOPLE'S 148, WAS THAT THE CELL PHONE RECORDS?

THE CLERK: YES.

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. IF THERE IS NO OBJECTION, MR. DOUGLAS, WE WILL SUBSTITUTE -- SUBSTITUTE THE CLEAN COPY FOR 148.

(PEO'S 148 FOR ID = CLEAN CC/SUBSTITUTED)

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY AND DEFENSE COUNSEL.)

(MR. DARDEN ENTERS THE COURTROOM.)

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. WE ARE NOW REJOINED BY MR. DARDEN. ALL RIGHT. MR. DOUGLAS, ANYTHING ELSE WE NEED TO TAKE UP BEFORE WE INVITE THE JURORS TO JOIN US?

MR. DOUGLAS: I DO HAVE A MATTER, YOUR HONOR, THAT I DO THINK MERITS SOME CONCERN AND ATTENTION BY THE COURT. YOUR HONOR, AS THE COURT WILL RECALL, ON MONDAY THERE HAD BEEN AN OBJECTION LODGED TO A QUESTION ASKED BY MISS CLARK OF MR. KAELIN. THE QUESTION CONCERNED WHETHER OR NOT MR. KAELIN HAD BEEN TOLD BY MR. SIMPSON THAT HE HAD HAD AN ANGRY ARGUMENT WITH HIS FORMER WIFE EARLIER THAT DAY. THERE HAD BEEN AN OBJECTION LODGED BY MR. SHAPIRO ARGUING THAT A GOOD FAITH BASIS FOR THAT QUESTION HAD NOT EXISTED AND THERE HAD BEEN AN OFFER OF PROOF MADE BY MISS CLARK AT SIDE BAR. I HAVE HAD OCCASION, YOUR HONOR, LAST NIGHT, TO REVIEW THOSE PARTICULAR RECORDS AND ALSO TO REVIEW A TRANSCRIPT OF THE SIDE BAR HEARING WHICH HAS BEEN COVERED QUITE BROADLY IN MANY OF THE MEDIA YESTERDAY, AND I'M TROUBLED, YOUR HONOR, BY SOME OF THE REPRESENTATIONS THAT WERE MADE AND THAT APPARENTLY FORMED THE BASIS FOR THE COURT TO OVERRULE MR. SHAPIRO'S OBJECTION TO THE GOOD FAITH BASIS FOR MISS CLARK HAVING ASKED THE QUESTION. I AM REFERRING SPECIFICALLY, YOUR HONOR, TO REFERENCES THAT MISS CLARK MADE THAT THERE HAD BEEN A WITNESS THAT WOULD TESTIFY THAT MR. SIMPSON ON THAT AFTERNOON OF JUNE THE 12TH HAD BEEN ANGRY AND YELLING AND THAT THERE WAS A SUGGESTION THAT THE ONLY CONVERSATION THAT THEIR RECORDS CONFIRMED HIS HAVING AT ABOUT THE TIME THAT HE WAS AT THE RIVIERA COUNTRY CLUB WAS IN FACT A CONVERSATION THAT HE HAD HAD WITH NICOLE BROWN SIMPSON. SPECIFICALLY, THERE WAS A COLLOQUY BETWEEN THE COURT AND MISS CLARK WHERE THE COURT ASKED: "SO THERE IS ONLY ONE CELL PHONE CALL ON HIS RECORDS THAT AFTERNOON?" MISS CLARK RESPONDS: "THAT WOULD MATCH THE TIME THAT HE WAS AT THE COUNTRY CLUB WHEN THIS WITNESS COULD HAVE SEEN HIM." THE COURT THEN ASKS: "WHEN YOU SAY 'MATCH THE TIME,' I MEAN ARE THERE OTHER CELL PHONE CALLS IN THE AFTERNOON?" MISS CLARK RESPONDS: "OTHER CELL PHONE CALLS BUT NOT WITHIN THE TIME FRAME WHEN HE WAS AT THE COUNTRY CLUB. YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN?" AND THE COURT RESPONDS: "UH-HUH." YOUR HONOR, IN REVIEWING THE CELL PHONE RECORDS OF MR. SIMPSON ON THAT DAY, I NOTED THAT THERE WERE TWELVE PARTICULAR -- I'M SORRY, SEVEN PARTICULAR CALLS THAT OCCURRED ON HIS CELL PHONE BETWEEN 2:12 IN THE AFTERNOON AND 2:24 IN THE AFTERNOON. THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN THE TIME FRAME THAT HE WAS AT THE COUNTRY CLUB. OF THOSE SEVEN CALLS THE THIRD OF THE SEVEN WAS THE FOUR-MINUTE CALL TO NICOLE BROWN SIMPSON ABOUT WHICH SHE REFERRED, MISS CLARK REFERRED. THAT MEANT, YOUR HONOR, THAT THERE WERE SIX OTHER CALLS OF MAYBE ONE OR TWO-MINUTE DURATION THAT WERE WITHIN THE TIME FRAME THAT COULD WELL HAVE BEEN ONE OF THE CALLS WHEN THE WITNESS SUPPOSEDLY SAW MR. SIMPSON ON THE PHONE, BUT IS DIRECTLY CONTRARY TO THE SUGGESTION OF MISS CLARK THAT THERE WAS ONLY ONE CALL THAT OCCURRED WITHIN THE TIME FRAME WHEN HE WAS AT THE COUNTRY CLUB. I'M ALSO TROUBLED, YOUR HONOR, BECAUSE IN REVIEWING A STATEMENT FROM THAT WITNESS THAT PROVIDED THE BASIS I'M SURE FOR MISS CLARK TO ARGUE THAT SHE HAD A GOOD FAITH BELIEF THAT MR. SIMPSON WAS ANGRY AND WAS YELLING ON THAT CONVERSATION, I SEE THAT THERE WAS NO REFERENCE AT ALL IN THE ENTIRE POLICE STATEMENT THAT MR. SIMPSON WAS YELLING, THAT HE WAS VERY ANGRY. INDEED, THE ONLY STATEMENT THAT IS WRITTEN IS THAT "O.J. APPEARED SERIOUS CONVERSATION, STERN FACE, DIFFERENT FACE, STRIKING A DIFFERENT O.J." AND WE HAD AN OCCASION TO SPEAK WITH THE WITNESS HERSELF YESTERDAY EVENING AND WHEN SHE WAS INFORMED THAT THERE WAS A SUGGESTION THAT SHE WOULD TESTIFY THAT MR. SIMPSON WAS ANGRY AND WAS YELLING, SHE WAS SOMEWHAT DISAPPOINTED THAT HER STATEMENTS TO THE POLICE COULD BE SO MISCONSTRUED BECAUSE SHE REFERRED TO THE FACT THAT TYPICALLY WHEN MR. SIMPSON WOULD GREET THIS INDIVIDUAL HE WOULD CALL HER HONEY BUNNY OR SOME SORT OF ENDEARING TERM AND ON THAT PARTICULAR DAY HE WAS SIMPLY ENGAGED IN SOME SORT OF CONVERSATION AND DID NOT ACKNOWLEDGE HER IN THAT TYPICAL WAY. AND THAT WAS THE ONLY SENSE THAT SHE WAS ATTEMPTING TO CONVEY IN TERMS OF THERE BEING A DIFFERENT O.J., BUT THAT HE WAS NEVER VERY ANGRY, HE WAS NEVER YELLING. I AM THEN THEREFORE, YOUR HONOR, TROUBLED BY THIS ERROR, BECAUSE IT APPEARS THAT IT WAS THE REPRESENTATION THAT GAVE THE COURT --

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN DEFENSE COUNSEL.)

MR. DOUGLAS: -- IT APPEARED THAT IT WAS THE REPRESENTATION THAT GAVE THE COURT THE BELIEF THAT THE QUESTION BEING ASKED WAS IN GOOD FAITH AND THAT THERE WAS IN FACT A BASIS FOR HER TO SUGGEST IN FRONT OF THE JURY TO MR. KAELIN THAT THERE HAD BEEN AN ARGUMENT BETWEEN MR. SIMPSON AND MISS BROWN SIMPSON. THE CALL THAT OCCURRED WAS ONLY A FOUR-MINUTE CALL. WE HAVE REASON TO BELIEVE THAT THE CALL CONCERNED SIMPLY AN ARRANGEMENT OF TICKETS FOR THE RECITAL BETWEEN MR. SIMPSON AND MISS BROWN SIMPSON WHO HAD IN FACT THE TICKETS IN HER POSSESSION AT THAT TIME. THERE WERE SIX OTHER CALLS THAT OCCURRED WITHIN THE SAME TIME FRAME. THERE APPEARS TO BE A MISREPRESENTATION TO THE COURT. I WOULD ARGUE, YOUR HONOR, THAT THIS MISREPRESENTATION TO THE COURT, GIVEN THAT IT OCCURRED IN A QUESTION THAT WAS POSED TO MR. KAELIN, TO WHICH THERE WAS AN OBJECTION, MERITS SOME SORT OF A STERN REMEDY. I WOULD ARGUE, YOUR HONOR, THAT THE REMEDY THAT WE WOULD SEEK FOR THIS TRANSGRESSION WOULD BE FIRST A STERN ADMONISHMENT TO MISS CLARK TO BE VERY CAREFUL IN HER QUESTIONING IN FRONT OF THE JURY. SECOND, THAT THERE BE AN ADMONISHMENT TO THE JURY THAT LAWYERS MUST HAVE A GOOD FAITH BASIS BEFORE ASKING A PARTICULAR QUESTION TO A WITNESS AND THE COURT FINDS THAT THERE WAS A QUESTION THAT WAS ASKED OF MR. KAELIN CONCERNING MR. SIMPSON APPARENTLY BEING ENGAGED IN AN ARGUMENT WITH HIS WIFE THAT WAS NOT ASKED IN GOOD FAITH AND THAT THE JURY IS SUPPOSED TO -- IS DIRECTED TO DISREGARD THE QUESTION AND THE IMPLICATIONS OF THE QUESTION BECAUSE IT WAS OFFERED IN BAD FAITH. AND I DO THINK, YOUR HONOR, WITH ALL DUE RESPECT, THAT THIS IS A TRANSGRESSION THAT MERITS SOME SORT OF A FINANCIAL SANCTION SO AS TO FULLY IMPRESS UPON EVERYONE IN THIS CASE THE OBLIGATIONS TO PLAY FAIR AND THAT IT IS CLEAR FROM MY PERSONAL EXPERIENCE, I KNOW, THAT A FINANCIAL SANCTION CERTAINLY CATCHES ONE'S ATTENTION. THE COURT HAS SUGGESTED ITS NEW POLICY OF IMPOSING SANCTIONS FOR SPEAKING OBJECTIONS, AND I THINK THAT THAT HAS RESULTED IN THEIR HAVING BEEN A GREAT SHORTAGE OF SPEAKING OBJECTIONS NOW, AND I THINK -- AND I'M NOT ONE WHO FREELY AND EASILY ASKS THE COURT TO IMPOSE SANCTIONS ON ANOTHER COUNSEL OF A FINANCIAL NATURE, BUT I THINK THIS IS NOT THE FIRST OCCASION THAT WE HAVE WITNESSED OCCURRENCES OF THIS KIND BEFORE THE JURY. I AM TROUBLED BY THAT AND I WOULD HOPE THAT SOMETHING COULD BE DONE SO THAT WE COULD OBVIATE THE NEED FOR THESE SORTS OF OCCURRENCES TO BE RAISED IN THE FUTURE.

THE COURT: THANK YOU, COUNSEL. MR. DARDEN.

MR. DARDEN: YOUR HONOR, CAN I SHOW YOU THE CELLULAR PHONE BILL?

MR. DOUGLAS: AND CAN I SHOW YOU THE STATEMENT?

THE COURT: SURE.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN DEFENSE COUNSEL AND THE DEFENDANT.)

THE COURT: THANK YOU.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

MR. DOUGLAS: AND YOUR HONOR, IF I MAY BE HEARD BRIEFLY? IT HAS BEEN REMINDED TO ME THAT THE STATEMENT OF THE WITNESS SUGGESTED THAT THE CONVERSATION HAD OCCURRED AT APPROXIMATELY FOUR O'CLOCK ON THAT EVENING, AND AS THE COURT WILL SEE BY LOOKING AT THE PHONE RECORDS, THERE WAS NO CELLULAR PHONE CALL MADE AT APPROXIMATELY FOUR O'CLOCK THAT DAY.

MR. DARDEN: WHICH IS OUR POINT EXACTLY. MISS ARTOONIAN COULD NOT BE EXACT ON THE TIME ON WHICH SHE OBSERVED THE DEFENDANT UPSET AND ANIMATED WHILE TALKING ON THE CELLULAR PHONE AT THE RIVIERA COUNTRY CLUB, BUT WE DO KNOW THAT HE WAS THERE AT 2:18 IN THE AFTERNOON. AS FOR THOSE 1.0, 2.0 MINUTE CALLS, THE CELLULAR PHONE COMPANY CAN TELL YOU, LIKE THEY HAVE TOLD US, THAT THIS DOESN'T MEAN THAT HE SPOKE TO ANYONE. ANYONE WHO HAS A CELLULAR PHONE CAN TELL YOU THAT AS WELL. WE STAND BY OUR REPRESENTATION. WE HAVE TALKED TO MISS ARTOONIAN. WHEN SHE TESTIFIES, HER TESTIMONY WILL BE VERY MUCH AS I BELIEVE AS WE REPRESENTED TO THE COURT. MISS ARTOONIAN CALLED US LAST NIGHT AND TOLD US THAT THE DEFENSE HAD CALLED HER AND ASKED HER ABOUT THE STATEMENT AND SHE SAID SHE STOOD BY HER STATEMENT, AND THAT APPARENTLY WAS THE GIST OF THE CONVERSATION THAT SHE HAD WITH THE DEFENSE. ON THE ISSUE OF GOOD FAITH, I HAVE SAT HERE THROUGHOUT THIS TRIAL AND I HAVE SEEN MANY, MANY INSTANCES OF BAD FAITH QUESTIONING ON THE PART OF THE DEFENSE; HOWEVER, I RECOGNIZE THAT THAT SOMETIMES IS SIMPLY THE NATURE OF CRIMINAL DEFENSE LITIGATION. TIME AND TIME AGAIN THE DEFENSE HAS SUGGESTED THAT THE BLOOD AT ROCKINGHAM WAS PLANTED BY THE POLICE WHEN EVEN THEY KNOW BY THE DEFENDANT'S OWN STATEMENT THAT HE WAS BLEEDING AT ROCKINGHAM PRIOR TO LEAVING FOR THE AIRPORT THAT NIGHT. EVERY TIME THEY MAKE THAT SUGGESTION TO THIS JURY AND TO THIS COURT THEY MAKE IT IN BAD FAITH. THIS IS A NON-ISSUE.

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU, COUNSEL. I WOULD LIKE TO READ THE -- CAREFULLY THE STATEMENT AND REVIEW THE PHONE RECORDS WHEN I HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY. I WOULD LIKE TO USE THE TIME WITH MR. PARK, HOWEVER, IN FRONT OF THE JURY AT THIS TIME, AND SINCE THIS ISSUE DOES NOT INVOLVE THIS PARTICULAR WITNESS, I WILL TAKE THIS UP AT A LATER TIME.

MR. DOUGLAS: YOUR HONOR, WOULD THE COURT LIKE TO SEE A COPY OF THE SIDE BAR WHERE THAT PORTION WAS REFERENCED?

THE COURT: YES, THAT WILL HELP ME IMMENSELY, TOO, IF YOU WILL GIVE THAT TO ME LATER. ALL RIGHT. BUT I DO WANT A COPY OF EACH OF THOSE ITEMS.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. LET'S HAVE THE JURY, PLEASE, AND WE WILL TAKE ONE TEN-MINUTE RECESS AT 11:00.

MR. DARDEN: WE WANTED TO LODGE AN OBJECTION TO THE BAGS BEFORE THEY ARE SHOWN TO THE JURY.

THE COURT: OKAY. HOLD THE JURY. HOLD THE JURY. MR. DARDEN.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

THE COURT: MR. DARDEN.

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS.)

MR. DARDEN: WE HAVE NO OBJECTION TO INTRODUCING TO THE WITNESS THE GOLF CLUBS AND BAG AND THE LOUIS VITTON BAG, HOWEVER AS FOR THE OTHER TIMES, IT APPEARS THAT --

MR. COCHRAN: THE WITNESS IS HERE. I'M SORRY.

THE COURT: MR. PARK, WHY DON'T YOU STEP OUTSIDE, PLEASE.

(MR. PARK EXITS THE COURTROOM.)

THE COURT: MR. DARDEN.

MR. DARDEN: THANK YOU, YOUR HONOR. WE HAVE NO OBJECTION TO THE DEFENSE PRESENTING TO THE WITNESS THE GOLF CLUB BAG, THE LOUIS VITTON BAG OR THE DUFFEL BAG ENROUTE FROM THE GRAND JURY; HOWEVER, THE OTHER TWO BAGS, THE BLACK GARMENT BAG AND THE SMALL BROWN LEATHER BAG WITH THE BLUE TRIM, WE DO HAVE OBJECTIONS TO BRINGING THOSE TO THE WITNESS. AND NO WITNESS HAS DESCRIBED EITHER ONE OF THOSE TWO BAGS DURING THEIR TESTIMONY. AND AS THE COURT NOTED IN CHAMBERS, THE SMALLER BAG APPEARS TO BE BRAND NEW AND IT HAS THE KEYS STILL ATTACHED TO IT, AS WELL AS THE TAG.

THE COURT: MR. COCHRAN.

MR. COCHRAN: YES. IF I MIGHT, YOUR HONOR, I THINK, FIRST OF ALL, WITH REGARD TO THE BLACK GARMENT BAG, THE BAG WITH THE "O.J.S." ON IT, I THINK WE COULD CERTAINLY REASONABLY UNDERSTAND THAT IF THAT BAG WAS FULL WITH CLOTHES AND FOLDED OVER IT WOULD VERY CLOSELY MATCH THE DESCRIPTION WE HAVE DESCRIBED OF A SECOND BLACK DUFFEL BAG.

AND I THINK THE BEST WAY TO FIND OUT OBVIOUSLY IS TO ASK THE WITNESS. I MEAN, THIS IS WHY THIS WITNESS IS HERE. WE DON'T WANT TO BRING EVERYBODY BACK FOUR OR FIVE TIMES. AND I THINK THE BAG NOW IS EMPTY, BUT IF HE HAD CLOTHES IN IT, AS YOU WOULD EXPECT IF SOMEONE WAS TAKING A TRIP, I THINK IT BECOMES VERY RELEVANT, AND THE BEST WAY IS TO ASK THE WITNESS. WITH REGARDS TO THE OTHER BAG AND THE NEWNESS OF THE BAG, MR. SIMPSON HAS NOT BEEN ABLE TO GO BACK OUT AND PICK OUT WHICH BAG OR WHATEVER. HE HAS BEEN IN CUSTODY. WITH REGARD, HOWEVER, YOU WILL NOTICE EVEN THE GOLF CLUBS STILL HAVE THE LABELS. THAT IS OF NO MOMENT. AND THE GOLF CLUBS HAVE OBVIOUSLY BEEN USED, SO THE FACT THAT IT LOOKS NEW OR HAS SOME KEYS ON IT I THINK IS NOT OF ANY MOMENT. THE QUESTION IS CAN THIS WITNESS DESCRIBE THESE? BECAUSE AFTER ALL, WE WERE NOT OUT THERE AND WE CAN'T PUT OUR JUDGMENT IN THIS. WE HAVE TO ASK THE WITNESS WHO WAS THERE.

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. AT THIS POINT I'M INCLINED TO SUSTAIN THE PROSECUTION OBJECTION UNTIL THE WITNESS TESTIFIES DESCRIBING THESE ITEMS IN PARTICULARITY, ANYTHING THAT EVEN COMES CLOSE TO THESE ITEMS.

MR. COCHRAN: I AM NOT VERY CLEAR YOUR HONOR. YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT JUST THE TWO ITEMS?

THE COURT: THAT'S CORRECT.

MR. COCHRAN: ALL RIGHT. I WANTED TO MAKE SURE I KNEW WHAT YOU WERE SAYING.

MR. DARDEN: WE HAVE HEARD A LOT THIS MORNING ABOUT GOOD FAITH AND I WOULD ASK THE COURT TO INQUIRE OF THE DEFENSE. IS IT THEIR CONTENTION THAT THAT SMALL LEATHER BAG, THE ONE WITH THE BLUE TAG, IS THE BAG MR. SIMPSON CARRIED?

THE COURT: ACTUALLY IT IS A BLUE BAG WITH BROWN LEATHER TRIM.

MR. DARDEN: THANK YOU.

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT.

MR. DARDEN: IS IT THEIR CONTENTION THAT THE WITNESS (SIC) CARRIED THAT BAG ON THE PLANE? IF NOT, THEY ARE ACTING IN BAD FAITH. WHY INTRODUCE IT TO THE WITNESS? THIS IS SUPPOSED TO BE A SEARCH FOR THE TRUTH AND WE SHOULDN'T BE TRYING TO TRICK WITNESSES TO GET TO THEM SAY SOMETHING THAT MIGHT AFFECT THEIR CREDIBILITY.

MR. COCHRAN: NOBODY IS TRYING --

MR. DARDEN: THAT SEEMS TO BE WHAT THEY ARE TRYING TO DO.

MR. COCHRAN: NOBODY IS TRYING TO TRICK ANYBODY. WITH ALL THEIR SEARCH WARRANT POWERS AND ALL THE THINGS THEY DID, THEY NEVER EVEN TRIED TO FIND THESE BAGS, JUST TALK ABOUT IT AND THROW ALL THESE THEORIES UP. LET'S NOT TRY AND TALK ABOUT TRICKING ANYBODY. WE ARE THE ONES, WITH THE COURT'S INDULGENCE AND HELP, WHO BROUGHT THESE BAGS IN HERE. YOU WILL ALLOW SOME FURTHER QUESTIONING AND WE WILL FIND OUT. I WASN'T THERE AND NEITHER WAS MR. DARDEN, SO CLEARLY THE WITNESS IS THE ONE WHO IS GOING TO BE ABLE TO TELL US WHETHER OR NOT THIS COMPORTS WITH HIS DESCRIPTION AND HIS RECOLLECTION THAT NIGHT. THAT IS ALL WE ARE TYING TO DO.

MR. DARDEN: WE HOPE TO PRESENT MORE EVIDENCE TOMORROW RELATIVE TO WHAT HAPPENED TO THE BAG IN WHICH THE BLOODY CLOTHES WERE CARRIED IN AND TONIGHT I HOPE TO PRESENT TO THE DEFENSE DISCOVERY ON THAT ISSUE AS SOON AS IT COMES INTO OUR POSSESSION. IN ANY EVENT, WE SHOULDN'T BE TRYING TO TRICK WITNESSES.

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. I NOTED THE OBJECTION. I SUSTAINED THE OBJECTION. UNLESS I HEAR A BETTER FOUNDATION, I HAVE INDICATED THAT I'M SUSTAINING --

MR. COCHRAN: YOU RULED AND AS USUAL THEY ARE TRYING TO GIVE A SOUND BITE FOR WHAT MIGHT BE OR FOR WHAT HE HOPES IS GOING TO HAPPEN. THEIR WHOLE CASE IS BASED UPON HOPES AND DREAMS AND THEY'RE EVAPORATING.

MR. DARDEN: NOBODY CALLS US THE DREAM TEAM, MR. COCHRAN.

THE COURT: COUNSEL, THE REPARTEE IS NOT NECESSARY. ALL RIGHT. LET'S HAVE THE JURORS, PLEASE.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

(THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT, IN THE PRESENCE OF THE JURY:)

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU, LADIES AND GENTLEMEN. PLEASE BE SEATED. ALL RIGHT. LET THE RECORD REFLECT WE HAVE NOW BEEN REJOINED BY ALL THE MEMBERS OF OUR JURY PANEL. GOOD MORNING, LADIES AND GENTLEMEN.

THE JURY: GOOD MORNING.

THE COURT: MY APOLOGIES TO YOU FOR THE LATE STARTING TIME; HOWEVER, WE HAVE BEEN ENGAGED THIS MORNING, BOTH IN CHAMBERS AND HERE IN OPEN COURT, ON MATTERS THAT PERTAIN TO THE TESTIMONY THAT YOU ARE HEARING TODAY, AND I HAD TO RESOLVE THOSE MATTERS BEFORE PRESENTING THE WITNESS AGAIN TO YOU. MR. PARK, WOULD YOU RESUME THE WITNESS STAND, PLEASE.

ALLAN PARK, THE WITNESS ON THE STAND AT THE TIME OF THE EVENING ADJOURNMENT, RESUMED THE STAND AND TESTIFIED FURTHER AS FOLLOWS:

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. GOOD MORNING, MR. PARK.

THE WITNESS: GOOD MORNING, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: YOU ARE REMINDED YOU ARE STILL UNDER OATH, SIR. AND MR. COCHRAN, YOU MAY CONTINUE YOUR CROSS-EXAMINATION.

MR. COCHRAN: THANK YOU VERY KINDLY, YOUR HONOR.

CROSS-EXAMINATION (RESUMED)

BY MR. COCHRAN:

Q: GOOD MORNING, MR. PARK.

A: GOOD MORNING, SIR.

MR. COCHRAN: GOOD MORNING, LADIES AND GENTLEMEN.

THE JURY: GOOD MORNING.

MR. COCHRAN: EXCUSE ME JUST A MOMENT, YOUR HONOR.

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY AND DEFENSE COUNSEL.)

MR. COCHRAN: THANK YOU, YOUR HONOR.

Q: NOW, MR. PARK, YOU HAD DESCRIBED FOR US I BELIEVE YESTERDAY HOW WHEN YOU PULLED TO THE ROCKINGHAM GATE YOU LOOKED INTO THE DRIVEWAY THERE AND ONE OF THE THINGS YOU WERE TRYING TO CONSIDER IS WHETHER OR NOT THE LIMOUSINE COULD BE PULLED IN THROUGH THE ROCKINGHAM GATE; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: AND YOU HAVE PREVIOUSLY TESTIFIED THAT YOU DID SEE TWO CARS IN THAT DRIVEWAY?

A: YES.

Q: AND ARE YOU SURE ABOUT THAT?

A: I'M PRETTY SURE. NOT POSITIVE, BUT THAT IS WHAT I OBSERVED.

Q: ALL RIGHT. YOUR BELIEF IS YOU SAW TWO CARS THERE?

A: YES.

Q: CAN YOU DESCRIBE THOSE TWO CARS FOR US?

A: THE ONE I KNOW WAS A ROLLS ROYCE. THAT IS SOMETHING THAT IS PRETTY OBVIOUS. THE OTHER ONE I WASN'T TOO SURE ABOUT; ANOTHER DARK CAR.

Q: ALL RIGHT. AS YOU WERE FACING LOOKING IN THE ROCKINGHAM GATE, WHICH OF THE TWO CARS WOULD BE -- WOULD BE CLOSEST TO YOU, SIR?

A: FROM WHAT I REMEMBER, THE ROLLS ROYCE.

Q: ALL RIGHT. AND SO WOULD YOU ACCEPT THAT THAT MIGHT BE A BENTLEY AS OPPOSED TO A ROLLS ROYCE? SAME FAMILY?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. IT WAS DARK IN COLOR; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. NOW, DID YOU HAVE OCCASION TO SEE SOME PHOTOGRAPHS OR SOMETHING AT OR ABOUT THE TIME THAT YOU TESTIFIED AT EITHER THE GRAND JURY OR THE PRELIMINARY HEARING WHERE YOU SAW TWO CARS IN THE DRIVEWAY AT SOME POINT?

A: NOT THAT I REMEMBER.

Q: ALL RIGHT. IF I WERE TO TELL YOU THAT THAT SECOND CAR DID NOT ARRIVE IN THAT DRIVEWAY UNTIL ABOUT ONE O'CLOCK P.M. -- ONE O'CLOCK A.M., WOULD THAT IN ANY WAY REFRESH YOUR RECOLLECTION THAT THERE WAS ONLY ONE CAR THERE WHEN YOU LOOKED IN THERE?

A: NO.

Q: YOUR BEST RECOLLECTION AS YOU SIT HERE NOW IS THAT YOU SAW TWO CARS WITH THE BENTLEY OR ROLLS ROYCE PARKED FIRST; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: FROM WHAT I REMEMBER, YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. AND THE SECOND CAR THEN, WHAT KIND OF CAR WAS THAT?

A: I DON'T KNOW WHAT KIND OF CAR IT WAS. IT JUST SEEMED TO BE ANOTHER DARK CAR.

Q: ALL RIGHT. DARK IN COLOR?

A: YES.

Q: AND YOU BELIEVE THAT THAT SECOND DARK-COLORED CAR WAS PARKED BEHIND THE BENTLEY?

A: YES.

Q: BUT AS I UNDERSTAND YOUR TESTIMONY AS YOU HAVE INDICATED, YOU ARE NOT SURE ABOUT THAT, ARE YOU?

A: NO.

Q: YOU JUST HAVE A RECOLLECTION OR IMPRESSION THAT YOU MAY HAVE SEEN TWO CARS?

A: YES.

Q: YOU ARE SURE, HOWEVER, THAT YOU DID SEE THE BENTLEY OR THE ROLLS ROYCE?

A: YES.

Q: IS THAT CORRECT?

A: I AM POSITIVE OF THAT, YES.

Q: THAT YOU ARE POSITIVE OF?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU. NOW, YOU YESTERDAY DESCRIBED FOR THE JURY SOME LUGGAGE THAT WAS PLACED IN THE BACK OF THE LIMOUSINE. YOU RECALL THAT?

A: YES.

Q: AND AS I UNDERSTAND YOUR TESTIMONY, YOU DESCRIBED FOR US A GOLF BAG THAT WAS ENCASED IN SOME KIND OF A SHEATH WITH SOME KIND OF EMBLEM THEREON; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: IF YOU WERE TO SEE THAT GOLF BAG AND WITH THE EMBLEM THEREON, YOU WOULD RECOGNIZE THAT, WOULD YOU NOT? DO YOU THINK YOU COULD?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. AND THEN YOU DESCRIBED FOR US A DESIGNER BAG THAT YOU HAD PREVIOUSLY CALLED GUCCI, BUT YESTERDAY YOU AND I HAD A CONVERSATION THAT IT MIGHT POSSIBLY BE LOUIS VITTON, RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: YOU DESCRIBED IT AS BEING KIND OF BEIGE; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. YOU ALSO PREVIOUSLY DESCRIBED WHAT YOU CALL A BLACK DUFFEL BAG AND YOU GAVE US SOME MEASUREMENTS OF ABOUT THREE FEET BY MAYBE ONE AND A HALF FEET IN WIDTH; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. AND YOU THINK YOU MIGHT BE ABLE TO IDENTIFY THAT IF YOU SAW IT ALSO?

A: I DON'T KNOW IF I CAN GIVE YOU A POSITIVE IDENTIFICATION, BUT I COULD SAY THAT IS WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE.

Q: I UNDERSTAND THAT. NO, I UNDERSTAND THAT IT WAS NIGHT, THINGS WERE DARK, AND IT HAS BEEN A LONG TIME?

A: YES.

Q: YOU CAN TELL US WHETHER OR NOT IT LOOKED SIMILAR? IS THAT A FAIR STATEMENT?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. NOW, WITH REGARD TO -- YOU TALKED ABOUT A SECOND BLACK DUFFEL BAG AS YOU DESCRIBED IT. WITH REGARD TO THAT, DO YOU RECALL WHETHER OR NOT -- THAT WAS BLACK IN COLOR, WAS IT NOT, THE SECOND BAG?

A: IT WAS DARK IN COLOR.

Q: YES. AND DO YOU RECALL WHETHER OR NOT YOU SAW ANY INITIALS OR ANYTHING ON THAT AT ALL?

A: NO.

Q: DO YOU RECALL? AND WAS IT FOLDED OVER AT THE TIME THAT YOU SAW IT IN SUCH A WAY THAT IT APPEARED THAT THERE WERE CLOTHES INSIDE OF IT IN SOME WAY?

A: WELL, WHICH BAG --

Q: THE SECOND BLACK DUFFEL BAG THAT YOU DESCRIBED FOR US YESTERDAY?

A: WHICH, THE TWO THAT WERE TOGETHER?

Q: YEAH, THE TWO THAT WERE ON THE GROUND. DID IT APPEAR -- WE WERE TALKING ABOUT ONE, NOW I'M TALKING ABOUT THE OTHER ONE.

A: OKAY.

Q: I'M ASKING YOU WHETHER OR NOT THE OTHER DUFFEL BAG, THE BLACK DUFFEL BAG, APPEARED TO LOOK AS THOUGH IT HAD SOME CLOTHES IN IT?

A: I DON'T KNOW WHAT IT HAD IN IT.

Q: ALL RIGHT. BUT DID IT LOOK -- AND LET ME ASK YOU THIS THEN: DID IT APPEAR AS THOUGH IT HAD SOMETHING INSIDE?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. AND ONE OF THOSE BAGS WAS OPENED PARTIALLY OR UNZIPPED AND YOU DIDN'T LOOK INSIDE, THOUGH?

A: NO, I DIDN'T.

Q: BASED UPON YOUR EXPERIENCE AND COMMON SENSE, YOU FELT THAT IT HAD SOMETHING IN IT AT THAT POINT; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: SO IT LOOKED FAIRLY FULL, DID IT?

A: YES, IT DID.

Q: OKAY. THEN YOU DESCRIBED FOR US YESTERDAY THIS OTHER BAG THAT WAS APPROXIMATELY TWENTY FEET AWAY FROM YOU ON THE DRIVEWAY. DO YOU REMEMBER THAT?

A: YES.

Q: CAN YOU AGAIN DESCRIBE THAT BY COLOR FOR US, IF YOU WOULD.

A: AGAIN ANOTHER DARK BAG. I NEVER REALLY HANDLED THAT BAG OR GOT CLOSE TO IT, SO --

Q: ALL RIGHT. AND AGAIN FROM THE STANDPOINT OF SIZE, CAN YOU HELP US WITH THE SIZE OF THAT BAG, SIR?

A: IT WAS A BIT SMALLER THAN THE OTHER ONES. IT SEEMED TO BE A FOOT AND A HALF ACROSS AND HALF TO A FOOT DEEP.

Q: ALL RIGHT. DO YOU RECALL WHETHER OR NOT IT HAD ANY HANDLES ON IT?

A: NO.

Q: ALL RIGHT. AND YOU NEVER GOT CLOSER THAN TWENTY FEET WITH REGARD TO THAT BAG; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: CORRECT.

MR. COCHRAN: ALL RIGHT. YOUR HONOR, I WOULD LIKE AT THIS POINT TO SHOW THE WITNESS A COUPLE BAGS.

MS. CLARK: I WOULD LIKE TO APPROACH, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. THE TWO THAT THERE ARE NO OBJECTION TO, YOU MAY.

MS. CLARK: WE WOULD LIKE TO APPROACH, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. WITH THE COURT REPORTER, PLEASE.

(THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD AT THE BENCH:)

MS. CLARK: WE GET HIT WITH THESE THINGS AT THE LAST MINUTE.

THE COURT: WE ARE AT THE SIDE BAR. MISS CLARK.

MS. CLARK: EXCUSE ME, YOUR HONOR. NO. 1 THING, THESE BAGS ARE NOT IN THE CONDITION THEY WERE IN WHEN THIS WITNESS SAW THEM. THEY ARE EMPTY NOW, THEY WERE FULL THEN, SO THEY ARE NOT THE SAME.

THE COURT: WAIT A MINUTE. WE ARE TALKING ABOUT THE GOLF CLUBS AND THE LOUIS VITTON.

MS. CLARK: THE LOUIS VITTON BAG IS EMPTY, TOO.

MR. COCHRAN: MAY I HAVE JUST ONE SECOND, PLEASE?

MS. CLARK: SURE.

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN DEFENSE COUNSEL.)

MR. COCHRAN: THANK YOU, YOUR HONOR.

MS. CLARK: YOU KNOW WHAT, CAN I LET MR. DARDEN HANDLE THIS?

MR. COCHRAN: ONE-LAWYER RULE.

MS. CLARK: I'M JUST TOO TIRED.

THE COURT: MISS CLARK.

MR. DARDEN: WE HAVE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS. FIRST, SO THAT THE JURY ISN'T MISLED, WE WOULD ASK THAT THERE BE SOME INFORMATION GIVEN TO THE JURY REGARDING THE RECOVERY --

THE COURT: OKAY.

MR. DARDEN: -- OF THE BAG AND THE CIRCUMSTANCES IN WHICH IT WAS RECOVERED. SECONDLY, I THINK WE ALL AGREE THAT THE BAG CONTAINED SOME ITEMS OF SOME NATURE.

MR. COCHRAN: WHICH BAG ARE WE TALKING ABOUT?

MR. DARDEN: LOUIS VITTON.

THE COURT: WHY DON'T YOU JUST ASK A FEW MORE QUESTIONS.

MR. COCHRAN: IN FACT, THAT IS WHAT THAT WAS ABOUT.

MR. DARDEN: LET ME FINISH. SO THERE WERE OTHER ITEMS INSIDE THE BAG. OKAY. THE BAG IS NOT NOW IN THE CONDITION IT WAS IN APPARENTLY WHEN IT RETURNED FROM CHICAGO, SO SOMEONE HAS REMOVED THE ITEMS FROM THE BAG. AND IF IT IS MR. KARDASHIAN OR HIS AGENT OR MR. COCHRAN OR HIS AGENTS, THEY HAVE A DUTY UNDER THE CASE LAW, I BELIEVE, TO INFORM THE COURT AND US AS TO THE CONDITION OF THE BAG WHEN IT WAS RECEIVED, AS WELL AS THE CONTENTS. IF IT HAS BEEN ALTERED IN ANY WAY, WE HAVE A RIGHT TO KNOW HOW.

MR. COCHRAN: LET ME JUST SAY THIS: THEY ARE MIXING APPLES AND ORANGES FROM THE STANDPOINT --

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS.)

MR. COCHRAN: I THINK, FIRST OF ALL, IF I CAN RESPOND, FIRST THEY ARE MIXING AND APPLES AND ORANGES. I'M ASKING THIS WITNESS TO IDENTIFY THE BAG. I WILL BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO TALK. I WASN'T THERE, JUDGE, ON JUNE 13TH AND I WASN'T THERE. WITH REGARD TO THE BAG, THE COURT KNOWS THE HISTORY OF IT, AND CHRIS -- MR. DARDEN, WE WILL ABSOLUTELY COMPORT WITH THAT ANYTIME THE COURT WANTS TO. IT IS CHAIN OF CUSTODY. BUT THAT IS NOT THE ISSUE. I'M TRYING TO SEARCH FOR THE TRUTH. I'M TRYING TO ASK THIS MAN -- HE WAS OUT THERE -- WHETHER OR NOT HE CAN IDENTIFY THIS BAG. I'M WILLING TO ASK WHAT THE CONDITION OF THE BAGS WERE BEFORE I PRESUME AT THAT POINT. IF THEY ARE NOT FULL --

MR. DARDEN: JOHNNIE, JOHNNIE, WE UNDERSTAND THAT AND WE ARE NOT STANDING HERE RIGHT NOW TRYING TO STOP FROM YOU SHOWING THE BAGS TO THIS WITNESS; HOWEVER, THERE IS ADDITIONAL INFORMATION WE HAVE A RIGHT TO HAVE AND WE WOULD LIKE TO HAVE IT IMMEDIATELY SO THAT WE CAN PREPARE TO DEAL WITH THE ISSUE.

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. THEN AT THIS POINT I'M GOING TO SUSTAIN A FOUNDATIONAL OBJECTION SIMPLY TO THE POINT THAT WHEN MR. PARK SAW THE LOUIS VITTON BAG IT WAS FULL. IN OTHER WORDS, IT APPEARED TO HAVE CLOTHING IN IT.

MR. COCHRAN: I DON'T KNOW IF IT WAS FULL, BUT I WILL ASK THE QUESTION.

THE COURT: AND THEN SECONDLY, THAT WHAT APPEARED TO BE A GOLF BAG APPEARED -- WHEN HE PUT IT IN THE LIMOUSINE, APPEARED TO HAVE A SET OF GOLF CLUBS IN IT, APPEARED TO BE A NORMAL GOLF BAG WITH GOLF CLUBS, ET CETERA.

MR. COCHRAN: THAT IS ALL I'M SAYING.

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS.)

MR. COCHRAN: WE DON'T WANT THE JURY INFORMED OF ANYTHING.

THE COURT: AND JUDGE WONG WILL BE AVAILABLE THIS AFTERNOON AT 1:30.

MR. COCHRAN: JUDGE, CAN I ASK ONE OTHER THING?

MS. CLARK: JUDGE, WITH RESPECT TO THE --

MR. COCHRAN: THERE IS TWO OF YOU.

MS. CLARK: HE IS GOING TO DO IT. HE IS GOING TO DO IT.

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS.)

MR. DARDEN: WOULD THE COURT BE INCLINED TO TELL THE JURY THE CIRCUMSTANCES IN WHICH THE BAG WAS RECOVERED PRIOR TO SHOWING IT TO THE WITNESS?

THE COURT: NO, BUT WE WILL PUT THAT -- THE ONLY REASON I'M NOT DOING THAT, JUDGE WONG IS NOT AVAILABLE RIGHT NOW. HE WILL BE AVAILABLE AT 1:30. WE WILL PUT HIM ON.

MR. DARDEN: NEXT ISSUE. MR. KARDASHIAN, WILL HE BE AVAILABLE THIS AFTERNOON?

THE COURT: YEAH.

MR. COCHRAN: THEY ARE COMING BACK, I PRESUME.

MR. DARDEN: ALL RIGHT.

THE COURT: I'M GOING TO MAKE JUDGE WONG AVAILABLE TO YOU AT 1:30 TO DISCUSS ANYTHING YOU WANT TO ABOUT A SPECIAL MASTER ACTIVITY AND THEN I WILL BRING THE JURY BACK AT TWO O'CLOCK.

MR. COCHRAN: JUDGE, MAY I ASK ONE OTHER THING?

MS. CLARK: THE ONLY THING I'M CONCERNED ABOUT IS THAT THE JURY REALIZES WE JUST DON'T GO IN THERE WITH A SEARCH WARRANT AND NOT FIND THESE THINGS. THEY WEREN'T THERE AND THE JURY IS NOW OF THE IMPRESSION THAT THEY WERE AT HIS HOUSE ALL ALONG AND WE DIDN'T BRING THEM.

MR. COCHRAN: I'M GOING TO ASK ABOUT WHERE IT WAS RECOVERED. SOME OF THEM WERE THERE. I SAW THAT BAG WHEN WE WENT OUT ON THE JURY VIEW AND I'M SURE SOME OF THEM SAW IT, SO THAT IS NOT GOING TO FLY.

THE COURT: IT WAS IN THE CLOSET.

MR. COCHRAN: IT WAS IN THE CLOSET, THE LOUIS VITTON BAG.

MR. DARDEN: THAT IS NOT WHAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT. WE ARE TALKING ABOUT JUNE 13.

MS. CLARK: RIGHT.

MR. DARDEN: THAT IS NOT THE BAG ANYWAY WE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT. WE DON'T CARE ABOUT THE LOUIS VITTON BAG.

THE COURT: THEN LET'S STOP FIGHTING ABOUT IT.

MR. COCHRAN: LET ME ASK YOU THIS: TALK ABOUT A FOUNDATIONAL ISSUE, JUST AS WE ARE TALKING ABOUT CLOTHES AND WHAT THE ISSUE WAS, IT IS OUR CONTENTION THAT THE O.J.S. BAG WAS THE OTHER BAG AND IT HAD CLOTHES IN IT AND SO I THINK I SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO ASK HIM IF THIS WAS SIMILAR, IF IT HAD CLOTHES IN IT OR HAD SOMETHING IN IT, WOULD BE SIMILAR.

THE COURT: WELL, ASK HIM SOME MORE FOUNDATIONAL QUESTIONS BECAUSE HE'S THE ONE WHO PUT IT IN THE LIMOUSINE. IF IT HAD HANDLES ON IT, WAS HE ABLE TO DESCRIBE WHAT A DUFFLE BAG IS. IF WE HAVE TO, I MEAN, I GOT AN L.L. BEAN CATALOG IN THE BACK AND YOU CAN ASK HIM PICK WHAT LOOKS LIKE IT.

MR. COCHRAN: YOUR HONOR --

THE COURT: THERE IS A BIG DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A GARMENT BAG AND A DUFFLE BAG.

MS. CLARK: THE EASIEST THING TO DO IS TO HAVE THE DUFFEL BAG HERE. DID THEY BOTH LOOK LIKE THIS.

MR. COCHRAN: I AM GOING TO DO THAT AT SOME POINT AND I'M GOING TO ASK A FEW MORE QUESTIONS.

MR. DARDEN: I KNEW HE HAD MORE THAN FIFTEEN MINUTES.

MR. COCHRAN: NO, THIS --

(THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT:)

MR. COCHRAN: SHALL I BRING THEM IN?

THE COURT: YES, AND A COUPLE MORE FOUNDATIONAL QUESTIONS.

MR. COCHRAN: MAY I PROCEED, YOUR HONOR?

THE COURT: YES.

MR. COCHRAN: THANK YOU, YOUR HONOR.

Q: MR. PARK, JUST A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS WITH REGARD TO THE TWO DUFFLE BAGS THAT WERE ON THE GROUND WHEN YOU PULLED IN WITH THE LIMOUSINE THAT WERE OUT IN FRONT OF MR. SIMPSON'S HOUSE. DO YOU RECALL THAT?

A: YES.

Q: CAN YOU DESCRIBE FOR US AND GIVE US A WORD PICTURE OF THE DUFFLE BAGS? YOU TOLD US THEY WERE BLACK IN COLOR; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: AND AS BETWEEN THE TWO BAGS, WAS THERE ANY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE TWO BAGS?

A: UMM, FROM WHAT I REMEMBER, THEY WERE PRETTY MUCH THE SAME.

Q: ALL RIGHT. AND WITH REGARD TO -- I HAVE TO ASK YOU WHETHER THERE WAS ANY WRITING ON EITHER ONE OF THEM AND DO YOU RECALL ANY WRITING AT ALL?

A: NO.

Q: AND DID THEY BOTH APPEAR AS THOUGH THEY HAD SOMETHING INSIDE OF THEM?

A: YES.

Q: CAN YOU DESCRIBE FOR US ANYTHING ABOUT THE HANDLES OF THESE TWO BAGS?

A: NO.

Q: ALL RIGHT. AND DID YOU PUT THE TWO DUFFLE BAGS INSIDE THE CAR?

A: YES.

Q: AND YOU ONLY HAD THEM FOR A VERY SHORT TIME, I PRESUME; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YEAH, SECONDS.

Q: AND THAT WASN'T SOMETHING YOU WERE CONCENTRATING ON, I PRESUME?

A: NO.

Q: ALL RIGHT. BUT WITH REGARD TO -- WHAT ELSE CAN YOU TELL US ABOUT THESE BAGS, THAT YOU HAVEN'T TOLD US THUS FAR? YOU TOLD US THE COLOR, YOU TOLD US THERE IS NO WRITING THAT YOU RECALL?

A: I'M NOT POSITIVE IF ONE HAD A SHOULDER STRAP OR NOT.

Q: IS IT POSSIBLE THAT ONE COULD HAVE BEEN CARRIED UP OVER ONE'S SHOULDER; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: AND AS WITH SOMETIMES -- AS SOMETIMES HAPPENS WITH THOSE BAGS WITH THE SHOULDER STRAPS, THEY CAN ALSO SOMETIMES BE FOLDED; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES, I GUESS.

Q: AND DO YOU RECALL ON THAT PARTICULAR NIGHT WHETHER OR NOT, AS IT APPEARS, THE DUFFEL BAG HAD BEEN FOLDED OVER WITH CLOTHES INSIDE OF IT? DO YOU RECALL?

A: NO.

Q: YOU DON'T RECALL?

A: NO.

Q: ALL RIGHT. IF YOU WERE TO SEE BOTH OF THESE BLACK DUFFLE BAGS AGAIN, DO YOU THINK YOU COULD TELL US WHETHER OR NOT IT APPEARS TO BE SIMILAR TO THE BAG YOU SAW THAT NIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: YOUR BEST TEST WOULD BE TO ACTUALLY LOOK AT IT, RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. CAN YOU TELL US ANYTHING ELSE THAT YOU HAVEN'T TOLD US THUS FAR ABOUT THE TWO BLACK DUFFLE BAGS?

A: THAT IS ABOUT ALL I REMEMBER, OTHER THAN ONE WAS UNZIPPED.

Q: OF THE TWO OF THEM, ONE WAS UNZIPPED?

A: YES.

Q: WHERE WERE THE ZIPPERS ON THAT PARTICULAR BAG, IF YOU RECALL?

A: THEY SEEMED TO BE IN THE MIDDLE.

Q: ALL RIGHT. ANOTHER ONE -- DID THE OTHER DUFFEL BAG HAVE ZIPPERS ALSO?

A: IT WAS CLOSED. I DON'T KNOW IF IT HAD A ZIPPER OR NOT. I DIDN'T ASK THEM TO --

Q: THIS WAS JUST A QUICK THING BECAUSE YOU WERE LATE?

A: YES.

MR. COCHRAN: I UNDERSTAND. I UNDERSTAND. YOUR HONOR, MAY I SHOW THE WITNESS A COUPLE OF BAGS?

THE COURT: THE FIRST TWO, YES.

MR. COCHRAN: THEY ARE NOW THREE, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: I'M SORRY?

MR. COCHRAN: THEY ARE NOW THREE.

THE COURT: THE FIRST TWO.

MR. COCHRAN: MAY WE APPROACH WITHOUT THE REPORTER?

THE COURT: YES.

(A CONFERENCE WAS HELD AT THE BENCH, NOT REPORTED.)

(THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT:)

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU, COUNSEL. MR. COCHRAN.

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN DEFENSE COUNSEL.)

MR. COCHRAN: YOUR HONOR, FOR THE RECORD, I WANT TO ASK -- I WANT TO ASK ONE QUESTION BEFORE I SHOW THE WITNESS THE BAGS.

Q: MR. PARK, DO YOU KNOW THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A GARMENT BAG, AS IT WERE, AND A DUFFEL BAG? DO YOU MAKE A DISTINCTION BETWEEN THE TWO OF THOSE?

A: YES.

Q: AND IF A GARMENT BAG IS FOLDED OVER WITH CLOTHES THEREIN, WOULD YOU AGREE THAT LOOKS VERY SIMILAR TO A DUFFEL BAG ON OCCASION?

A: IT COULD.

Q: ALL RIGHT. DO YOU -- DO YOU KNOW -- THE SECOND BLACK BAG THAT YOU SAW THAT NIGHT, DO YOU KNOW WHETHER OR NOT THAT WAS POSSIBLY A GARMENT BAG THAT WAS FOLDED OVER WITH CLOTHES THEREIN?

A: NOT POSITIVE, NO.

Q: YOU DON'T KNOW?

A: NO.

Q: AGAIN, WOULD THE BEST TEST OF THAT BE FOR YOU TO ACTUALLY SEE A BAG AND THEN MAKE A DETERMINATION?

A: YES.

MR. COCHRAN: ALL RIGHT, YOUR HONOR. YOUR HONOR, MAY I -- I WOULD LIKE TO MARK AS DEFENDANT'S NEXT IN ORDER 1062, WHAT APPARENTLY IS A GARMENT BAG, COUNSEL HAS SEEN IT, A LOUIS VITTON GARMENT BAG. AND I WOULD LIKE, IF I MIGHT, TO APPROACH MR. PARK.

THE COURT: YES. FOLD-OVER GARMENT BAG.

(DEFT'S 1062 FOR ID = GARMENT BAG)

MR. COCHRAN: LOUIS VITTON WITH A PANEL.

Q: MR. PARK, I WANT TO PLACE THE DEFENDANT'S 1062 BEFORE YOU AND WHY DON'T YOU JUST TAKE A MINUTE AND TAKE A LOOK AT THAT AND SEE WHETHER OR NOT THE BAG THAT YOU TALKED ABOUT YESTERDAY BEING A DESIGNER BAG APPEARS SIMILAR TO DEFENDANT'S 662 -- 1062 FROM THE NIGHT OF JUNE 12, 1994, SIR?

A: UMM, IT IS VERY SIMILAR, IF NOT THE BAG.

Q: ALL RIGHT. AND DO YOU WANT TO LOOK AT IT ANY MORE?

A: NO.

Q: LOOKS VERY SIMILAR?

A: YES.

Q: AND DO YOU SEE THESE LITTLE LV'S ON IT?

A: YES.

Q: THAT LOOKS LIKE WHAT YOU SAW THAT NIGHT; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: DO YOU SEE ANYTHING ELSE ABOUT THIS BAG THAT LOOKS FAMILIAR, THE LABEL? DID YOU HAPPEN TO SEE WHETHER OR NOT THE SKYCAPS PUT A LABEL ON IT THAT NIGHT WHERE THIS BAG WAS GOING?

A: NO, I DIDN'T.

Q: DO YOU RECALL WHETHER OR NOT THE DESIGNER BAG YOU SAW THAT NIGHT HAD A HERTZ LABEL WITH THE NAME "SIMPSON" ON IT? DO YOU RECALL THAT?

A: NO.

Q: YOU DON'T RECALL SEEING THAT?

A: NO.

Q: DO YOU RECALL SEEING "PREMIUM SERVICE FLAGSHIP SERVICE AMERICAN AIRLINES"?

A: NO.

Q: BUT HE WENT OUT ON AMERICAN AIRLINES?

A: YES.

Q: SO YOUR TESTIMONY IS THIS BAG, DEFENDANT'S 1062 FOR IDENTIFICATION, MAY VERY WELL BE THE BAG THAT YOU HAD THAT NIGHT; IS THAT CORRECT, OR SAW THAT NIGHT?

A: YES, IT LOOKS VERY FAMILIAR.

MR. COCHRAN: OKAY, SIR. I WOULD LIKE NOW, YOUR HONOR, TO SHOW I GUESS WHAT WILL BE MARKED AS DEFENDANT'S 1063. THAT WILL BE BROUGHT BY MR. DOUGLAS.

(DEFT'S 1063 FOR ID = GOLF BAG)

MR. COCHRAN: THANK YOU, MR. DOUGLAS.

Q: YOU HAVE PREVIOUSLY DESCRIBED FOR US WHAT YOU BELIEVE WAS A GOLF BAG AND YOU TOLD US THAT IT HAD SOME KIND OF AN INSIGNIA ON IT; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: WE ARE NOW PLACING BEFORE YOU NOW DEFENDANT'S 1063 FOR IDENTIFICATION. DO YOU RECOGNIZE THIS BAG AT ALL?

A: NO.

Q: DO YOU SEE AN INSIGNIA ON THIS BAG THAT LOOKS FAMILIAR TO YOU AT ALL?

A: NO.

Q: DOES THIS -- DOES THE CONFIGURATION OF THIS PARTICULAR BAG SEEM SIMILAR TO THE GOLF BAG THAT YOU SAW ON THAT PARTICULAR NIGHT?

A: SOMEWHAT SIMILAR, BUT I DON'T THINK IT IS THE SAME.

Q: IT DOESN'T LOOK THE SAME TO YOU?

A: NO.

Q: IF IT WERE TO -- WOULD IT BE HELPFUL FOR YOU -- DID YOU SEE THE CLUBS THAT NIGHT?

A: YES. NOT THE CLUBS ITSELF, BUT THE BAG.

Q: YOU SAW A SHEATH OF SOME KIND?

A: YES.

Q: HOW DOES THIS SHEATH LOOK DIFFERENT FROM THE ONE THAT YOU SAW?

A: IT DIDN'T SAY "SWISS ARMY" LIKE THAT AND IT WASN'T THAT BIG.

Q: THE "SWISS ARMY" THING?

A: YES. AND IT SEEMED TO BE A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT. IT WASN'T AS BULKY.

Q: DIDN'T SEEM THAT BULKY?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. IF WE CAN UNZIP IT. DID YOU EVER HAVE IT UNZIPPED AT ALL THAT NIGHT? HAVE YOU LOOK AT THE BAG AND THE CLUBS INSIDE? DID YOU AT ANY TIME THAT NIGHT SEE WHAT APPARENTLY IS A SET OF GOLF CLUBS AND SOME KIND OF BLACK GOLF BAG WITH A TOP THEREON, A SLEEVE OR SOMETHING THEREON, AND IT HAS ANOTHER INSIGNIA, "SWISS ARMY" -- "SWISS ARMY" --

A: BRANDS.

Q: -- "BRANDS LIMITED"?

A: I NEVER SAW IT LIKE THAT, NO. IT HAD ANOTHER SHEATH, BUT I DON'T -- I DON'T RECALL SEEING IT WRITTEN LIKE THAT.

Q: ALL RIGHT.

A: IT SEEMED TO BE A DIFFERENT EMBLEM.

Q: ALL RIGHT. IT SEEMED TO BE A DIFFERENT EMBLEM, AS YOU RECALL?

A: YES.

Q: DID YOU -- THIS PARTICULAR BAG I THINK YOU DESCRIBED FOR US, THE GOLF BAG, WAS PLACED IN THE VEHICLE BY MR. KATO KAELIN?

A: THAT'S CORRECT.

Q: SO YOU DIDN'T HANDLE IT, PER SE; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: NO, I WAS THERE WHEN HE PUT IT IN. WELL, I HANDLED IT AT THE AIRPORT.

Q: YOU TOOK IT OUT AND PUT IT ON THE CART OF THE GENTLEMEN WHO WAS CHECKING?

A: YES.

Q: SO YOUR BEST RECOLLECTION IS THAT THIS SET OF GOLF CLUBS DOES NOT APPEAR TO BE SIMILAR TO THE ONES YOU SAW THAT NIGHT OR COULD YOU SAY ONE WAY OR THE OTHER?

A: WELL, IT COULD BE THE GOLF CLUBS, BUT IT JUST SEEMED TO BE A DIFFERENT SHEATH THAN THIS ONE OVER IT.

Q: WAS THE SHEATH YOU SAW THIS NIGHT, WAS IT DARK ALSO?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THIS SHEATH AND THE SHEATH THAT YOU RECALL THAT NIGHT HAS TO DO THE EMBLEM; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: THE EMBLEM THAT YOU RECALL THAT NIGHT SAID "SWISS ARMY" ALSO, DID IT?

A: IT DIDN'T SAY IT LIKE THAT. IT WASN'T WRITTEN AS BIG.

Q: OKAY.

A: IT SEEMED TO BE JUST A LITTLE SILK SCREEN WHITE TRIANGLE EMBLEM, ALMOST LIKE THE CENTER OF THIS, JUST THE RED PART.

Q: YOU CAN RETURN TO THE MICROPHONE SO I CAN RESTATE WHAT YOU ARE SAYING. YOU ARE SAYING THAT THE SWISS -- FIRST OF ALL, LET ME ASK YOU THIS: DID THE BAG YOU SAW THAT NIGHT HAVE A SHEATH THAT HAD SWISS ARMY ON IT?

A: I'M NOT POSITIVE. I'M PRETTY SURE IT SAID SWISS ARMY. IT WAS MORE OF AN EMBLEM. LIKE I SAID, IT WASN'T WRITTEN THAT BIG.

Q: I GUESS THE POINT IS DID IT HAVE A "SWISS ARMY"?

A: YES.

Q: I THINK YOU TESTIFIED TO THAT YESTERDAY?

A: YES.

Q: WHAT YOU ARE TELLING US IS THAT YOUR RECOLLECTION IS THAT THE INSIGNIA "SWISS ARMY" APPEARS DIFFERENT THAN THE SHEATH THAT WAS ON DEFENDANT'S 1063? IS THAT WHAT YOU ARE SAYING?

A: YES.

Q: OKAY. HOW LONG WOULD YOU SAY -- THANK YOU, MR. DOUGLAS -- WOULD YOU SAY YOU LOOKED AT THAT PARTICULAR BAG OR THAT GOLF BAG WITH THE INSIGNIA THAT PARTICULAR NIGHT? HOW LONG -- HOW MUCH TIME DID YOU SPEND LOOKING AT IT?

A: NOT VERY LONG AT ALL. I NOTICED IT.

Q: A MATTER OF SECONDS WOULD YOU SAY?

A: YES.

Q: AND --

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN DEFENSE COUNSEL.)

THE COURT: COUNSEL, I WOULD JUST SUGGEST FOR A MOMENT THAT YOU JUST PROP THE BAG UP ON THE RAIL FOR THE JURORS SO THAT THEY CAN SEE THE EMBLEM THAT WE HAVE BEEN TALKING ABOUT.

MR. COCHRAN: SURE.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU, COUNSEL.

MR. COCHRAN: MAY WE DO THE SAME THING FOR THE OTHER BAG, YOUR HONOR, THE LOUIS VITTON BAG?

THE COURT: YES.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

MR. COCHRAN: THANK YOU, YOUR HONOR.

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN DEFENSE COUNSEL AND THE DEFENDANT.)

MR. COCHRAN: THE OTHER ONE IS NOT HERE YET, YOUR HONOR.

Q: NOW, HAD YOU EVER BEFORE THAT NIGHT EVER SEEN A SWISS ARMY INSIGNIA ON A BAG BEFORE THAT NIGHT?

A: ON A BAG?

Q: YES. ON ANY KIND OF A BAG, LUGGAGE?

A: NO.

Q: DO YOU KNOW WHETHER OR NOT THEY HAVE MORE THAN ONE KIND OF INSIGNIA ON BAGS, SWISS ARMY COMPANY?

A: YES.

Q: WHAT IS THE ANSWER TO THAT? DO YOU KNOW THE ANSWER?

A: (NO AUDIBLE RESPONSE.)

Q: WHAT IS THE ANSWER TO THAT? DO THEY HAVE MORE THAN ONE KIND OF INSIGNIA ON LUGGAGE?

A: I SAID YES.

Q: OKAY. YOU KNOW THAT THEY HAVE DO HAVE? YOU HAVE SEEN MORE THAN ONE KIND?

A: YES.

Q: OKAY. WHEN DID YOU SEE -- WHEN DID YOU MAKE THIS OBSERVATION?

A: JUST NOW.

Q: ALL RIGHT. AND BY THE FACT THAT THE ONE YOU SAW HERE YOU FELT WAS DIFFERENT FROM WHAT YOU HAVE SEEN IN THE PAST?

A: YES.

Q: IS THAT HOW YOU MADE THAT DETERMINATION?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. NOW, DO YOU RECALL THAT WHEN YOU TESTIFIED AT THE PRELIMINARY HEARING YOU INDICATED THAT WHEN YOU FIRST ARRIVED AT THE LOCATION YOU MISSED OR PASSED BY THE RESIDENCE THERE ON ROCKINGHAM. DO YOU RECALL THAT?

A: YES, I DO.

Q: AND IN FACT YOU HAD INDICATED THAT YOU CAME UP ROCKINGHAM GOING NORTH AND YOU WERE GOING A LITTLE BIT FAST. DO YOU REMEMBER TESTIFYING TO THAT?

A: YES.

Q: AND SO YOU ACTUALLY MISSED THE HOUSE, RIGHT, AT THAT POINT?

A: WELL, I DIDN'T MISS THE HOUSE. I CAUGHT THE ADDRESS ON THE SIDE OF THE CURB, SO I KNEW IT WAS THE HOUSE, BUT -- BUT I -- I WOULD SAY I MISSED THAT GATE.

Q: WELL, NOW, LET ME JUST ASK YOU THIS: WHAT WAY WERE YOU GOING WHEN YOU CAME UP WHEN YOU WERE GOING A LITTLE BIT FAST WHEN YOU FIRST GOT THERE?

A: I WAS HEADING NORTH.

Q: WHAT DID YOU DO AFTER THAT AS YOU WERE HEADING NORTH?

A: THAT IS WHEN I TURNED DOWN -- MADE A RIGHT ONTO ASHFORD HEADING EAST.

Q: DID YOU GO HALFWAY DOWN ASHFORD AT THAT POINT?

A: YES.

Q: YOU CAME BACK AND YOU PARKED AT THAT POINT?

A: YES.

Q: THAT IS WHEN YOU PARKED ACROSS FROM THE ASHFORD GATE; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: NOW, I WANTED TO ASK YOU, YOU WERE GOING BY A LITTLE BIT FAST WHEN YOU SPOTTED THE ADDRESS ON THE SIDEWALK; IS THAT RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: AND SO YOU WERE DRIVING AND LOOKING AT THE LETTERS ON THE SIDEWALK AS YOU WENT PAST AND YOU WENT ON UP TO ASHFORD; IS THAT RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: AND AS YOU TOLD US EARLIER, AT THAT POINT YOU WERE FOCUSING ON THE ADDRESS AND ON THE HOUSE AT THAT POINT; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: AND IN ADDITION TO THAT, AS YOU TOLD US YESTERDAY, YOU WERE NOT FOCUSING ON ANY CARS, PARTICULAR CARS PARKED THERE; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: THAT'S CORRECT.

Q: AND YOU CANNOT TELL THIS JURY POSITIVELY THAT A VEHICLE WAS PARKED THERE OUTSIDE THE ROCKINGHAM GATE OR NOT, CAN YOU?

A: NO.

Q: IN FACT, WHEN YOU LEFT TO GET TO THE AIRPORT WHEN YOU WENT --

MS. CLARK: OBJECTION, YOUR HONOR. I BELIEVE THAT MISSTATES THE TESTIMONY. I BELIEVE THE WITNESS IS CONFUSED ABOUT THE TIME FRAME.

MR. COCHRAN: YOUR HONOR, CROSS-EXAMINATION.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: IN FACT, WHEN YOU LEFT THE ROCKINGHAM GATE, SIR, AND YOU WERE GOING TO PULL OUT TO HEAD TO THE AIRPORT TO GO BACK TOWARD SUNSET, AT THAT POINT YOU DON'T RECALL WHETHER OR NOT YOU SAW ANY PARKED CARS; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: THAT'S CORRECT.

Q: ALL RIGHT. AND THAT IS WHAT YOU INDICATED TO OFFICER TIPPIN ON JUNE 15TH IN THE CONVERSATIONS YOU HAD, RIGHT?

A: CORRECT.

Q: THAT IS WHAT YOU INDICATED AT THE GRAND JURY; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: THAT IS WHAT YOU INDICATED AT THE PRELIMINARY HEARING WHEN YOU TESTIFIED; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: AND AT ALL TIMES THROUGHOUT YOUR TESTIMONY YOU HAVE ALWAYS TRIED TO BE ACCURATE AND AS ACCURATE AS YOU COULD; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: AND YOU AGREED WITH ME THAT YOUR TESTIMONY FOR EVENTS THAT TRANSPIRED ON JUNE 12TH IN THE LATE EVENING HOURS WAS OBVIOUSLY BETTER BACK IN JUNE THAN IT IS NOW SOME EIGHT OR NINE MONTHS LATER IN MARCH OF 1995; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: I WOULD SAY IT IS THE SAME.

Q: YOUR -- I KNOW YOU ARE VERY YOUNG, BUT IS YOUR MEMORY -- THAT IS A COMPLIMENT BY THE WAY -- BUT YOUR MEMORY EVEN AT YOUR AGE TENDS TO GET A LITTLE WORSE OVER A PERIOD OF TIME, DOESN'T IT?

A: I WOULD AGREE ON THAT.

Q: ALL RIGHT. THAT IS WHAT I'M SAYING. SO WHEN EVENTS ARE FRESHER IN YOUR MIND THEY ARE LIKELY TO BE MORE ACCURATE; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: THAN WHEN TIME PASSES A LITTLE BIT; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. NOW, LAST -- YESTERDAY, I ASKED YOU SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT THE FACT THAT JUNE 12TH WAS A SUNDAY EVENING AND THE STREET IN AND AROUND ROCKINGHAM AND ASHFORD WERE QUIET THAT NIGHT; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: THAT'S CORRECT.

Q: WOULD YOU CHARACTERIZE THAT AS KIND OF A QUIET NEIGHBORHOOD?

A: YES.

Q: AND AS SUCH YOU TOLD US IN FACT THAT YOU OBSERVED AND SAW CARS THAT WERE COMING AND PASSING BY -- BY YOU; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: BUT YOU NEVER AT ANY TIME SAW ANY CAR COME UP, STOP OR HEARD ANYBODY GET OUT OR SLAM ANY DOORS; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: CORRECT.

Q: YOU NEVER WENT OVER TO INSPECT ANY CARS THAT PARTICULAR NIGHT, ANY PARKED CARS, DID YOU?

A: NO.

Q: THAT WAS AGAIN BECAUSE YOUR JOB WAS TO PICK UP THIS CLIENT AND GET HIM TO THE AIRPORT ON TIME; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: AND NOTHING ELSE WAS IMPORTANT TO YOU AT THAT POINT; ISN'T THAT CORRECT, EXCEPT GETTING THE CLIENT THERE SAFELY?

A: THAT IS ABOUT IT.

Q: YOU DID THAT? YOU GOT HIM THERE SAFELY AND RELATIVELY ON TIME; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: I ASKED YOU SOME QUESTIONS YESTERDAY ABOUT THIS PARTITION INSIDE THE LIMOUSINE. YOU DESCRIBED FOR US HOW THAT WORKS IN A LIMOUSINE THAT COULD SEPARATE THE DRIVER'S COMPARTMENT FROM WHERE YOUR CLIENT OR THE CUSTOMER IS. HOW DOES THAT WORK?

A: THERE IS A BUTTON IN THE BACK THAT THE CLIENT OR WHOEVER YOU HAVE IN THE CAR CAN PUT UP THE DIVIDER. THERE IS A GLASS ONE THAT YOU CAN SEE THROUGH AND THEN THERE IS ANOTHER FULLY DARK ONE, LIKE A WOOD BORDER THAT GOES UP IN BETWEEN IF YOU WANT TOTAL PRIVACY.

Q: ALL RIGHT. AT ANYTIME DID MR. SIMPSON EVER PUT THIS TOTAL PRIVACY PARTITION UP THAT NIGHT?

A: NO.

Q: AT ANY TIME DID HE EVEN PUT THE CLEAR ONE UP THAT NIGHT?

A: NO.

Q: IN OTHER WORDS, HE LEFT IT DOWN AT ALL TIMES; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: AND WHEN IT IS DOWN, YOU ARE ABLE TO COMMUNICATE, JUST TALK BACK AND FORTH; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: AND IN FACT IN MOST LIMOUSINES, WAS IT TRUE IN YOURS, THAT IF YOU HAD PUT THE ONE OF TOTAL PRIVACY UP THERE IS USUALLY A PHONE IN THE BACK WHERE YOU CAN TALK BACK AND FORTH IF YOU WANTED TO; ISN'T THAT RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: BUT IN YOUR CONVERSATIONS THAT YOU HAVE DESCRIBED FOR US WITH MR. SIMPSON, THE TWO OF YOU WERE JUST ABLE TO TALK BACK AND FORTH; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: CORRECT.

Q: NOW, YESTERDAY YOU DESCRIBED FOR US THIS -- THIS FIGURE OF THIS PERSON THAT YOU SAW, YOU RECALL, AND YOU TOLD US THAT, AS I UNDERSTAND IT, WHEN YOU FIRST OBSERVED THIS FIGURE, THIS PERSON WAS JUST ABOUT IN THE ENTRANCEWAY OF THE ROCKINGHAM RESIDENCE, RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: AND YOU COULD NOT TELL US FROM WHENCE -- STRIKE THAT. YOU COULD NOT TELL US FROM WHERE THAT INDIVIDUAL HAD COME; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: CORRECT.

Q: AND YOU SAW THIS INDIVIDUAL FOR JUST A FLEETING PERIOD OF TIME, JUST A SECOND OR TWO; IS THAT RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: AND YOUR OBSERVATION AT THAT TIME WAS FROM OUTSIDE THE GATE ON THE ASHFORD GATE; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: THAT'S CORRECT.

Q: ALL RIGHT. DID YOU EVER, WHEN YOU FIRST SAW THIS FIGURE OF THIS PERSON WHO WAS GOING TOWARD THE FRONT DOOR OF ROCKINGHAM, SIR, DID YOU EVER SEE OR OVERHEAR ANY CONVERSATION BETWEEN THIS PERSON THAT YOU SAID WAS WEARING SOMETHING DARK, PERHAPS EVEN A ROBE, WITH THE GENTLEMAN WHO YOU DESCRIBED AS KATO KAELIN LATER? DID YOU SEE THEM AT ALL TALKING WHEN YOU SAW THIS FIGURE OF THIS INDIVIDUAL?

A: NO.

Q: WHEN YOU -- AND KATO KAELIN THEN LET YOU INSIDE AND YOU PULLED INSIDE, YOU TOLD US ABOUT YOUR OBSERVATIONS, YOU THEN HAD A CONVERSATION WITH HIM; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: WITH KATO KAELIN?

A: YES.

Q: AND THEN AS WE UNDERSTAND, IT WAS WITHIN FIVE, NO MORE THAN SIX MINUTES, THAT YOU THEN SAW MR. O.J. SIMPSON COME DOWN AND YOU THEN SAW HIM FOR THE FIRST TIME?

A: THAT'S CORRECT.

Q: AND SO THAT WE ARE CLEAR FOR THE JURY, THE BAG THAT HE WAS CARRYING WHEN HE CAME DOWN, WHEN YOU FIRST SAW HIM, WITHIN FIVE OR SIX MINUTES AFTER YOU GOT THERE, IS THAT THE BAG THAT LOOKED SIMILAR TO THE LOUIS VITTON BAG THAT WE JUST SHOWED THE JURY?

A: YES.

Q: AND HE WAS CARRYING THAT BAG IN HIS HAND?

A: YES.

Q: AND WAS IT FOLDED OVER IN THE FASHION IT APPEARED HERE?

A: YES.

Q: AND THE TWO DUFFEL BAGS WERE ALREADY OUTSIDE?

A: YES.

Q: NOW, WHEN YOU WERE IN AND AROUND THAT DRIVEWAY, I MAY HAVE ASKED YOU THIS YESTERDAY, YOU NEVER SAW ANY BLOOD DROPS ANYWHERE ON THAT DRIVEWAY, DID YOU?

A: NO, I DIDN'T.

Q: YOU NEVER SAW ANY BLOOD DROPS IN THE FOYER AREA OF THE RESIDENCE THAT I SHOWED YOU A PICTURE OF YESTERDAY?

MS. CLARK: OBJECTION. THIS ASSUMES FACTS NOT IN EVIDENCE.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: DID YOU?

A: NO, I DIDN'T.

Q: SINCE JUNE 12, 1994, HAVE YOU HAD OCCASION TO GO BACK OUT TO ROCKINGHAM AT ALL, THAT LOCATION?

A: NO.

Q: YOU HAVE NEVER BEEN OUT THERE WITH THE POLICE OR ANYTHING?

A: NO.

Q: YOU DESCRIBED FOR MISS CLARK YESTERDAY THAT YOU WORE GLASSES BECAUSE YOU HAD TROUBLE SEEING THINGS FAR AWAY. YOU ARE NEARSIGHTED, RIGHT?

A: CORRECT.

Q: AND HOW DO YOU DETERMINE WHEN YOU ARE GOING TO WEAR YOUR GLASSES?

A: PRETTY MUCH JUST WHEN I FEEL LIKE IT. I DON'T WEAR THEM VERY OFTEN AT ALL.

Q: SO IT IS JUST --

A: I THINK THEY MAKE MY EYES WORSE.

Q: REALLY?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. AT ANY RATE, YOU DIDN'T HAVE THEM ON THAT NIGHT, DID YOU?

A: NO.

Q: NOW, WITH REGARD TO MR. DALE ST. JOHN, DID YOU TALK TO HIM AT ALL ANY MORE THAT NIGHT AFTER YOU DROPPED MR. SIMPSON OFF?

A: NO, I DIDN'T.

Q: WHEN DID YOU NEXT TALK TO HIM, IF YOU DID, IN CONNECTION WITH TAKING MR. SIMPSON TO THE AIRPORT?

A: I THINK IT WAS THE NEXT MORNING.

Q: AND DID YOU KEEP THE LIMOUSINE WITH YOU THAT PARTICULAR NIGHT, IF YOU RECALL?

A: IT WAS AT HIS HOUSE, WHICH IS ACROSS THE STREET.

Q: YOU TOOK IT BACK TO HIS HOUSE?

A: YES.

Q: AND THEN JUST WALKED HOME; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: NOW, YOU HAVE, HAVE YOU NOT, SEEN PICTURES OF THE ROCKINGHAM RESIDENCE DURING THE TIMES YOU HAVE MET WITH MISS CLARK AND THE OTHERS AT THE D.A.'S OFFICE; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: IN FACT, WHEN YOU MET WITH HER LAST FRIDAY IN THIS BUILDING, LIKE ELEVEN O'CLOCK ON, AT THAT TIME YOU WENT OVER SOME PHOTOGRAPHS OR PICTURES AT THAT POINT, DID YOU NOT?

A: A FEW, YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. AND SOME OF THOSE FEW PICTURES WERE OF THE ROCKINGHAM RESIDENCE, WERE THEY?

A: YES.

Q: WHEN YOU WERE PARKED BEFORE YOU WENT TO THE -- EITHER THE ROCKINGHAM GATE OR THE ASHFORD GATE, WHEN YOU WERE PARKED, I GUESS ON ASHFORD, YOU WERE PARKED IN A WAY YOU COULD LOOK DOWN ROCKINGHAM, WERE YOU?

A: NOT ACTUALLY DOWN ROCKINGHAM. I WAS JUST LOOKING AT IT.

Q: YOU COULD LOOK AT ROCKINGHAM; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: IS THAT WHILE YOU WERE IN THE CAR?

A: (NO AUDIBLE RESPONSE.)

Q: IS THAT WHILE YOU WERE STILL SEATED IN THE CAR?

A: YES.

Q: AND WHEN YOU GOT OUTSIDE THE CAR AND KIND OF WALKED AROUND AND WALKED TO THE REAR OF THE CAR, COULD YOU SEE DOWN TOWARD ROCKINGHAM AT THAT POINT?

A: NO. I WAS SITTING ON THE CURB LOOKING, WHICH WOULD HAVE BEEN DOWN THE ASHFORD GATE AT THE RESIDENCE.

Q: THE ASHFORD GATE TOWARD THE RESIDENCE AT THAT POINT, RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: THE VEHICLE WAS POINTED FORWARD AND YOU GOT OUT AND WERE LOOKING -- WHAT DIRECTION IS THAT?

A: THAT WOULD BE SOUTH.

Q: LOOKING SOUTH AT THAT POINT?

A: THE CAR WAS POINTING WEST.

Q: WEST AT THAT POINT? ALL RIGHT. YOUR HONOR, I UNDERSTAND THAT THE OTHER ITEM MAY BE HERE.

THE COURT: YES. MISS CLARK, DO YOU WANT TO TAKE A LOOK AT IT.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

(A CONFERENCE WAS HELD AT THE BENCH, NOT REPORTED.)

(THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT:)

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. MR. COCHRAN, DO YOU WANT TO MARK THAT ITEM?

MR. COCHRAN: YES. I THINK THIS WOULD BE --

THE COURT: 1064.

MR. COCHRAN: -- 1064.

(DEFENSE 1064 FOR ID = BLACK BAG)

Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: WHEN YOU WERE UP IN THE D.A.'S OFFICE MEETING MISS CLARK LAST FRIDAY, DO YOU REMEMBER WHAT PICTURES SHE SHOWED YOU OF ROCKINGHAM?

A: I DON'T RECALL.

Q: WERE THEY SOME OF THE SAME PHOTOGRAPHS THAT WE SAW YESTERDAY DURING YOUR DIRECT EXAMINATION?

A: YES.

Q: SO THEY LOOKED FAMILIAR? AND DID YOU SEE ANY OF THE BOARDS HERE AT THAT TIME ALSO?

A: UMM, THE PHONE RECORDS.

Q: YOU SAW THE PHONE RECORDS?

A: YES.

Q: AND YOU SAW SOME PICTURES THAT LOOKED SIMILAR TO THE PICTURES THAT YOU SEE HERE; IS THAT RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: OKAY. I'M GOING TO APPROACH YOU FIRST AND SHOW YOU A BLACK BAG. COUNSEL HAS SEEN IT. AND I'M GOING TO ASK YOU WHETHER OR NOT THIS BLACK BAG -- I WILL PLACE IT BEFORE YOU -- STRIKE THAT. LET ME JUST PLACE THE BLACK BAG BEFORE YOU FIRST. WILL YOU TAKE A LOOK AT THAT, PLEASE, SIR.

A: (WITNESS COMPLIES.) THIS ONE LOOKS FAMILIAR.

Q: NOW, YOU HAVE HAD OCCASION TO LOOK AT THAT BLACK BAG?

A: YES.

Q: DOES THAT BLACK BAG LOOK SIMILAR TO EITHER ONE OF THE BLACK DUFFLE BAGS THAT YOU HAVE DESCRIBED FOR THE JURY TO THIS POINT?

A: YES, IT DOES.

Q: AND DOES IT LOOK DISSIMILAR AT ALL?

A: IT LOOKS VERY SIMILAR.

Q: ALL RIGHT. IT LOOKS VERY SIMILAR?

A: YES.

Q: SO THIS COULD HAVE WELL BEEN ONE OF THE BLACK DUFFLE BAGS THAT WERE OUT IN FRONT OF THE SIMPSON HOME IN FRONT OF THE ENTRANCEWAY; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: THAT'S CORRECT.

MR. COCHRAN: ALL RIGHT. MAY I MOVE IT CLOSER TO THE JURY, YOUR HONOR?

THE COURT: YES.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

MR. COCHRAN: NOW, I WANT TO SHOW YOU ANOTHER BAG. COUNSEL HAS SEEN IT.

THE COURT: WE WILL MARK THIS DEFENSE 1065.

MR. COCHRAN: 1065.

(DEFENSE 1065 FOR ID = BAG)

MR. COCHRAN: I WILL PLACE 1065 BEFORE YOU.

Q: ASK YOU TO TAKE A LOOK, FIRST OF ALL, AT 1065.

A: (WITNESS COMPLIES.)

Q: NOW, WITH REGARD TO DEFENDANT'S 1065, IT IS OBVIOUSLY EMPTY, IT DOESN'T HAVE ANYTHING INSIDE OF IT. IT DOES HAVE, FIRST OF ALL, A HANDLE APPARENTLY ON IT. DOES THIS LOOK SIMILAR TO ANY OF THE -- EITHER ONE OF THE BLACK BAGS YOU SAW ON THAT PARTICULAR NIGHT?

A: NO, NOT THAT I REMEMBER.

Q: YOU DON'T RECALL SEEING A BAG THAT LOOKS SIMILAR TO THIS THAT NIGHT?

A: NO.

Q: IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

MR. COCHRAN: ALL RIGHT. WITH REGARD -- YOUR HONOR, I WOULD LIKE TO PLACE ON THE ELMO, IF I COULD, DEFENDANT'S 66-E, IF I CAN, AT THE MOMENT.

THE COURT: DEFENDANT'S OR PROSECUTION?

MR. COCHRAN: PROSECUTION 66-E. THANK YOU.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: NOW, CAN YOU SEE 66-E THERE?

A: YES.

Q: AND I JUST WANTED TO HAVE YOU TAKE A LOOK AT THAT AGAIN AND CAN YOU HELP US AND SHOW US -- I DON'T WANT TO PARTICULARLY WRITE ON THIS PARTICULAR DIAGRAM -- BUT PERHAPS A WORD PICTURE WILL BE HELPFUL -- WHERE THE VEHICLE YOU DESCRIBED AS THE ROLLS ROYCE OR THE BENTLEY WAS PARKED IN THAT DRIVEWAY BY USING THE VARIOUS DESCRIPTIONS THAT ARE DEPICTED ON 66-E?

A: IT WOULD HAVE BEEN JUST ABOUT IN THAT LITTLE INLET AREA RIGHT ABOVE THE WORD "DRIVEWAY" ON THE ROCKINGHAM DRIVEWAY.

Q: RIGHT ABOVE THE WORD "DRIVEWAY"?

A: A LITTLE BIT FARTHER TOWARD THE STREET.

Q: ALL RIGHT. SO THE BENTLEY WOULD BE THERE?

A: YES.

MR. COCHRAN: AND MISS CLARK HAS NO OBJECTION, IF WE WERE, YOUR HONOR, TO MARK THAT AREA FOR THE BENTLEY. SHOULD WE PUT -- PUT A BOX THERE.

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY AND DEFENSE COUNSEL.)

Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: ALL RIGHT. AND IT WAS POINTED TOWARD THE ROCKINGHAM GATE, RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: SO THAT MARK ON 66-E IS THE -- WHY DON'T YOU PUT AN "RR" BY THAT.

THE COURT: WHAT ABOUT "B"?

MS. CLARK: EVERYBODY IS CALLING IT A ROLLS ROYCE.

MR. COCHRAN: THEY ARE SIMILAR, YOUR HONOR. WE WILL MAKE IT A "B."

MS. CLARK: CAN WE MAKE IT A "BE" TO DISTINGUISH IT FROM THE OTHER "B"?

THE COURT: WELL, IT IS IN WHITE.

MS. CLARK: OKAY.

Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: IS THAT A FAIR APPROXIMATION OF WHERE YOU BELIEVE YOU SAW THE BENTLEY THAT PARTICULAR NIGHT, SIR?

A: YES.

Q: NOW, THIS OTHER CAR, THIS OTHER DARK CAR, DO YOU RECALL WHERE THAT CAR WOULD BE IN RELATIONSHIP TO THE -- TO THE BENTLEY?

A: RIGHT BEHIND IT.

MR. COCHRAN: ALL RIGHT. AND SO WE MAY EITHER MAKE A VERY SMALL CAR OR RUN INTO THAT OTHER "B," BUT RIGHT BEHIND IT? MR. HARRIS, CAN YOU DO THAT?

Q: RIGHT IN THAT AREA THERE, (INDICATING)?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. THAT IS THE ONE YOU ARE NOT POSITIVE ABOUT, RIGHT?

A: CORRECT.

Q: IT WAS DARK?

MS. CLARK: WELL --

THE COURT: WELL, MR. COCHRAN, I REALLY DON'T THINK IT IS NECESSARY TO MARK IT. THE JURY HAS BEEN THERE; THEY HAVE SEEN IT.

MR. COCHRAN: ALL RIGHT. THAT IS FINE.

THE COURT: THEY KNOW WHAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT.

MR. COCHRAN: FINE. NO PROBLEM THEN, YOUR HONOR. SO WE KNOW THE AREA. THANK YOU, YOUR HONOR.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

MR. COCHRAN: MAY I HAVE JUST A MOMENT, YOUR HONOR?

THE COURT: CERTAINLY. PERHAPS THIS WOULD BE A GOOD MOMENT. I NEED TO GIVE MY COURT REPORTER A BRIEF RECESS.

MR. COCHRAN: YES, THANK YOU.

THE COURT: LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, WE ARE GOING TO TAKE A TEN-MINUTE COMFORT RECESS FOR THE COURT REPORTER. PLEASE REMEMBER MY ADMONITION TO YOU. DON'T DISCUSS THE CASE AMONGST YOURSELVES, DON'T FORM ANY OPINIONS, DON'T CONDUCT ANY DELIBERATIONS, DON'T LET ANYBODY COMMUNICATE WITH YOU. I'M GOING TO ASK YOU TO STEP BACK INTO THE JURY ROOM. WE WILL BE IN RECESS FOR TEN MINUTES. ALL RIGHT. MR. PARK, YOU CAN STEP DOWN. WE WILL BE IN RECESS FOR TEN MINUTES.

(RECESS.)

(THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT, OUT OF THE PRESENCE OF THE JURY:)

THE COURT: LET'S HAVE THE JURY, PLEASE.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

(THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT, IN THE PRESENCE OF THE JURY:)

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU, LADIES AND GENTLEMEN. BE SEATED. MR. PARK, WOULD YOU RESUME THE WITNESS STAND, PLEASE.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

THE COURT: LET THE RECORD REFLECT THAT WE HAVE BEEN REJOINED BY ALL THE MEMBERS OF OUR JURY PANEL. GOOD MORNING AGAIN, MR. PARK. YOU ARE REMINDED YOU ARE STILL UNDER OATH. MR. COCHRAN, YOU MAY CONTINUE.

MR. COCHRAN: YOUR HONOR, LADIES AND GENTLEMEN.

Q: MR. PARK, YOU DESCRIBED FOR US BRIEFLY YESTERDAY THE STRETCH LIMO. HOW LONG IS THAT STRETCH LIMO, SIR, IF YOU RECALL?

A: UMM, I DON'T KNOW THE EXACT LENGTH. IT IS, I WOULD SAY, APPROXIMATELY 28 FEET.

Q: AND IT DOES REQUIRE SOME MANEUVERING WHEN YOU ARE TURNING IT, DOES IT NOT?

A: YES.

Q: I WANT YOU TO TAKE A LOOK AT A PHOTOGRAPH AND I WANT TO ASK YOU A COUPLE QUESTIONS REGARDING THE PHOTOGRAPH. MAY WE SEE I THINK IT IS PEOPLE'S 136. THANK YOU. CAN YOU SEE PEOPLE'S 136 FOR IDENTIFICATION THERE?

A: YES.

Q: BY THE WAY, HAVE YOU EVER SEEN THAT PARTICULAR PHOTOGRAPH BEFORE?

A: YES, I HAVE.

Q: AND COULD YOU HAVE SEEN THAT PHOTOGRAPH IN MISS CLARK'S OFFICE?

A: YES.

Q: LAST FRIDAY?

A: POSSIBLY, YES.

Q: AND WE HAVE ALREADY COVERED THE FACT THAT YOU ARE CLEAR ABOUT THE BENTLEY, BUT NOT SO CLEAR ABOUT THE CAR BEHIND, RIGHT?

A: CORRECT.

Q: AND DOES THAT PHOTOGRAPH COMPORT WITH YOUR PRESENT RECOLLECTION OF HOW THE CARS WERE CONFIGURED THAT NIGHT WHEN YOU WERE LOOKING INTO THE ROCKINGHAM GATE?

A: YES.

Q: NOW, WITH REGARD TO THE STRETCH LIMO, AS I UNDERSTAND IT, IN ORDER FOR YOU TO COME OUT THE ROCKINGHAM GATE, YOU WOULD HAVE TO COME RIGHT DOWN THE DRIVER'S SIDE OF THOSE TWO CARS DEPICTED IN PEOPLE'S 136 FOR IDENTIFICATION; IS THAT RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: AND DO YOU KNOW, AS YOU LOOK AT THAT PHOTOGRAPH, IN RECALLING THAT PARTICULAR DRIVEWAY, WHETHER IT WOULD HAVE BEEN POSSIBLE TO MANEUVER THAT STRETCH LIMOUSINE AROUND TWO CARS AS THEY ARE PARKED AND CONFIGURED THERE?

A: I WOULDN'T KNOW THAT.

Q: YOU DON'T KNOW THAT, DO YOU?

A: NO.

Q: DO YOU AGREE IT WOULD BE A LOT EASIER IF THAT SECOND CAR WASN'T THERE, TO GET OUT OF THAT DRIVEWAY; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

MS. CLARK: OBJECTION. CALLS FOR SPECULATION.

THE COURT: OVERRULED. CAN YOU TELL FROM THAT PICTURE?

THE WITNESS: NO.

Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: ALL RIGHT. WELL, LET ME ASK YOU THIS WAY: WITH REGARD TO THE WAY THE CARS APPEAR THERE, YOU CAN'T TELL WHETHER IT IS POSSIBLE TO MANEUVER THE STRETCH LIMOUSINE AROUND THEM; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: FROM THAT PICTURE, NO.

Q: HOWEVER, YOU WOULD AGREE, WOULD YOU NOT, THAT IF THERE WERE ONLY ONE VEHICLE THERE IT WOULD TEND TO BE EASIER TO GET AROUND THERE WHERE YOU HAVE TWO VEHICLES PARKED IN TANDEM; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: AS WE SIT HERE NOW, DOES THAT PHOTOGRAPH, PEOPLE'S 136, IN ANY WAY REFRESH YOUR RECOLLECTION OF WHETHER OR NOT THERE WERE ONE OR TWO CARS THERE ON JUNE 12TH IN THE LATE EVENING HOURS?

A: NO, IT DOESN'T.

Q: OKAY. NOW, SIR, WITH REGARD TO THE STRETCH LIMOUSINE, YOU SPOKE WITH OFFICERS TIPPIN AND CARR ON OR ABOUT JUNE 15, 1994; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: CORRECT.

Q: AND YOU SPOKE TO THEM IN PERSON AND ALSO BY PHONE; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: AND WHEN YOU SPOKE TO THEM IN PERSON WAS IT AT THE HARBOR DIVISION OF THE LAPD?

A: YES, IT WAS.

Q: ALL RIGHT. AND AFTER THEY TALKED TO YOU WERE YOU AWARE OF WHETHER OR NOT THEY WENT AND LOOKED INSIDE THE REAR OF THIS -- THE STRETCH LIMOUSINE?

A: YES. I -- I TOLD THEM THAT MIGHT BE A GOOD IDEA. IT HADN'T BEEN USED SINCE THAT NIGHT.

Q: SO THESE TWO OFFICERS, TIPPIN AND CARR, LOOKED INSIDE THE VEHICLE?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. WERE WITH YOU THEM AT THAT POINT?

A: NO.

Q: ALL RIGHT. YOU TOLD THEM TO DO THAT, RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: LASTLY, DID YOU HAVE ANY, AS YOU THINK BACK ON THAT NIGHT, WHEN YOU CAME OUT THE ROCKINGHAM GATE TO THEN GO UP TO SUNSET AND GO TO THE AIRPORT, DID YOU HAVE ANY TROUBLE IN GETTING OUT OF THAT DRIVEWAY AND NEGOTIATING THE TURN FROM IN FRONT OF THE HOUSE TO GO OUT THE DRIVEWAY, IF YOU RECALL?

A: NO, I DIDN'T HAVE ANY TROUBLE. I DIDN'T HIT ANYTHING.

Q: WELL, THAT IS THE ULTIMATE TEST, ISN'T IT?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. BUT I WANT YOU TO THINK BACK FOR A MOMENT. DO YOU RECALL ANY PROBLEMS IN NEGOTIATING OR MANEUVERING?

A: NO.

Q: ALL RIGHT. YOU DIDN'T HIT ANYTHING?

A: NO.

MR. COCHRAN: THANK YOU. I HAVE NOTHING FURTHER OF THIS WITNESS AT THIS POINT, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: MISS CLARK.

MS. CLARK: YOUR HONOR.

REDIRECT EXAMINATION

BY MS. CLARK:

Q: GOOD MORNING, MR. PARK.

A: GOOD MORNING.

MS. CLARK: GOOD MORNING.

THE JURY: GOOD MORNING.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: LET ME FIRST ASK YOU, WHEN YOU WERE AT THE DEFENDANT'S HOME ON THE NIGHT OF JUNE THE 12TH, WERE YOU IN A HURRY?

A: UMM, I WAS -- IT DEPENDS ON WHAT POINT IN TIME.

Q: WELL, WHEN YOU -- WHEN YOU FINALLY SAW -- LET ME ASK YOU. THAT IS GOOD -- THANK YOU. BY THE TIME THE DEFENDANT CAME DOWNSTAIRS TO THE LIMOUSINE WERE YOU IN A HURRY?

A: I SEEM -- YES.

Q: AND DID HE APPEAR TO BE IN A HURRY?

A: YES.

Q: WERE YOU SPENDING TIME TRYING TO STUDY THE DEFENDANT, HIS HAND AND HIS BODY, WHEN HE CAME DOWNSTAIRS?

A: NO.

MR. COCHRAN: OBJECT TO THAT, YOUR HONOR. IT IS LEADING AND SUGGESTIVE, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: REPHRASE THE QUESTION.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: HOW CAREFULLY WERE YOU TRYING TO OBSERVE THE DEFENDANT'S BODY AND HANDS WHEN HE CAME DOWNSTAIRS FINALLY TO THE LIMOUSINE?

A: NOT AT ALL.

Q: DID YOU PAY ANY ATTENTION TO HIS HAND AT ALL?

A: NO.

Q: SHAKE HIS HAND OR HAVE ANY PHYSICAL CONTACT WITH HIM, WITH HIS BODY OR HIS PERSON?

A: SHOOK HIS HAND, YES.

Q: AND WHICH HAND DID YOU SHAKE?

A: RIGHT HAND.

Q: EVER TOUCH THE LEFT HAND?

A: NO.

Q: YOU TOLD US, I THINK, THAT HE WAS CARRYING A BLACK OVERCOAT?

A: YES.

MR. COCHRAN: OBJECT. MISSTATES.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: DO YOU RECALL WHETHER HE HAD THAT OVERCOAT DRAPED OVER HIS LEFT ARM?

A: WHAT I SAID, I DON'T REMEMBER IF HE HAD IT ON OR IF HE WAS CARRYING IT.

Q: OKAY. AND IF HE WAS CARRYING IT, DO YOU RECALL WHICH ARM, WHETHER IT WOULD HAVE BEEN THE RIGHT OR THE LEFT ARM, THAT HE HAD IT OVER?

MR. COCHRAN: YOUR HONOR -- THIS CALLS FOR SPECULATION, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: SUSTAINED.

MR. COCHRAN: THANK YOU.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: WHEN YOU WERE AT THE -- OKAY. YOU INDICATED, I THINK EARLIER, THAT YOU WERE ON ASHFORD TWICE IN TWO DIFFERENT POSITIONS THAT NIGHT, CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: WHEN YOU WERE PARKED ON ASHFORD --

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS.)

Q: BY MS. CLARK: OKAY. I'M SHOWING YOU PEOPLE'S 63, SIR. I BELIEVE YOU INDICATED THAT THE FIRST TIME YOU PARKED ON ASHFORD YOU SAID YOU PARKED IN THAT LOCATION WHERE YOU SEE THAT BLACK JEEP IN THE PHOTOGRAPH?

A: THAT'S CORRECT.

Q: AND THAT YOU SAT BEHIND THE LIMO ON THE CURB?

A: CORRECT.

Q: WERE YOU ABLE TO SEE THE ROCKINGHAM GATE FROM YOUR POSITION BEHIND THE LIMOUSINE ON THE CURB?

A: NO, I WASN'T.

Q: WERE YOU ABLE TO -- AND THEN LATER ON I THINK YOU INDICATED THAT YOU PARKED FACING IN TOWARDS THE ASHFORD. DO YOU RECALL THAT?

A: YES.

Q: WERE YOU ABLE TO SEE THE ROCKINGHAM GATE FROM YOUR POSITION FACING THE ASHFORD GATE?

A: NO, I WASN'T.

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS.)

Q: BY MS. CLARK: OKAY. PEOPLE'S 64, THAT IS THE ASHFORD GATE. DO YOU RECALL THAT?

A: YES.

Q: AND WHILE YOU WERE SEATED IN THAT LIMOUSINE AFTER YOU HAD POINTED IT IN TOWARDS THE ASHFORD GATE, DID YOU HAVE THE RADIO ON AT ANY POINT?

A: I THINK IT WAS ON, BUT I DON'T KNOW HOW LOUD IT WAS. IT WAS DOWN VERY LOW.

Q: OKAY. WHAT WAS YOUR ATTENTION DIRECTED TOWARDS WHEN YOU WERE SEATED THERE IN THE LIMOUSINE FACING INTO THE ASHFORD GATE?

A: REPEAT THAT.

Q: WHAT WAS THE FOCUS OF YOUR ATTENTION AT THAT TIME?

A: MY FOCUS? I WAS MORE OR LESS JUST LOOKING AT THE HOUSE, SEEING IF THERE WAS ANY LIGHTS ON.

Q: UH-HUH.

A: STUFF LIKE THAT. I MEAN, WHEN I RANG THE BUZZER NOBODY WAS THERE, SO --

Q: WERE YOU PAYING ATTENTION TO THE TRAFFIC ON THE STREET, EITHER ON ASHFORD OR ON ROCKINGHAM?

A: NO.

Q: WAS THAT IMPORTANT TO YOU?

A: NO.

Q: WAS IT IMPORTANT TO YOU AT THAT TIME TO DETERMINE WHICH CARS MAY HAVE STOPPED OR NOT?

A: NO.

Q: OR WHICH MAY HAVE PARKED ON ROCKINGHAM OR NOT?

A: NO.

Q: DO YOU EVEN KNOW IF YOU COULD HAVE HEARD A CAR PULL UP ON ROCKINGHAM FROM YOUR POSITION AT THE ASHFORD GATE?

MR. COCHRAN: CALLS FOR SPECULATION.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

THE WITNESS: NO.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: WOULD IT HAVE BEEN SIGNIFICANT TO YOU, IF YOU HAD?

A: NO.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

Q: BY MS. CLARK: NOW, WHEN YOU -- WHEN YOU FIRST PULLED UP -- WHEN YOU FIRST PULLED UP ROCKINGHAM AT ABOUT 10:22, YOU INDICATED EARLIER YOU WERE LOOKING FOR ADDRESSES ON THE CURB SO YOU COULD FIND THE DEFENDANT'S HOUSE; IS THAT RIGHT? DO YOU RECALL THAT?

MR. COCHRAN: I'M GOING TO OBJECT TO THIS NARRATIVE QUESTION, YOUR HONOR. IT IS NOT A QUESTION; IT IS A STATEMENT. I OBJECT TO THE FORM.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

THE WITNESS: YES, I WAS.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: OKAY. ARE YOU SURE THAT YOU WERE DOING THAT, SIR?

A: LOOKING FOR THE ADDRESS?

Q: YES.

A: POSITIVE.

Q: NO DOUBT IN YOUR HIND ABOUT THAT?

MR. COCHRAN: YOUR HONOR -- THAT IS ASKED AND ANSWERED, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

THE WITNESS: NO DOUBT.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: AND WHEN YOU INDICATED TO US THAT YOU SAW THE ADDRESS OF 360 ON THE CURB OF ROCKINGHAM, ARE YOU SURE ABOUT THAT?

MR. COCHRAN: THIS IS ASKED AND ANSWERED, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

THE WITNESS: YES.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: DO YOU HAVE ANY DOUBT ABOUT THAT?

A: NO.

MR. COCHRAN: ASKED AND ANSWERED.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: AND WHEN YOU WERE LOOKING AT THE CURB AND YOU SAW THIS ADDRESS, YOU INDICATED EARLIER THAT YOU DID NOT SEE A WHITE FORD BRONCO. DO YOU RECALL SAYING THAT?

MR. COCHRAN: OBJECT. THIS IS LEADING AND SUGGESTIVE, YOUR HONOR, THE FORM OF THIS QUESTION.

THE COURT: I ASSUME THIS IS FOUNDATIONAL TO SOMETHING ELSE.

MS. CLARK: YES, IT IS.

MR. COCHRAN: IT IS LEADING STILL, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

THE WITNESS: NO.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: AND ARE YOU SURE ABOUT THAT?

MR. COCHRAN: OBJECT. LEADING AND SUGGESTIVE, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: OVERRULED. YOU CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION.

THE WITNESS: I WASN'T LOOKING FOR IT. I DIDN'T SEE IT.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: ARE YOU SURE YOU DIDN'T SEE IT?

MR. COCHRAN: JUST A MOMENT, YOUR HONOR. ASKED AND ANSWERED.

THE COURT: OVERRULED. YOU CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION.

THE WITNESS: I WOULDN'T SAY I'M POSITIVE. I WASN'T LOOKING FOR A CAR. I WAS LOOKING FOR AN ADDRESS.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: OKAY. WHEN YOU LOOKED AT THE ADDRESS ON THE CURB --

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS.)

MS. CLARK: PEOPLE'S 62-A.

Q: DO YOU RECALL DRIVING BY THAT LOCATION, SIR?

A: YES.

Q: AND THE ADDRESS INDICATED ON THE CURB, THAT IS WHERE YOU SAW IT THAT NIGHT AT ABOUT 10:22?

A: YES.

Q: AND WHEN YOU WERE LOOKING IN THAT LOCATION DID YOU SEE A WHITE FORD BRONCO?

MR. COCHRAN: OBJECT TO THE FORM OF THAT QUESTION. ASKED AND ANSWERED, IMPROPER REDIRECT EXAMINATION.

THE COURT: OVERRULED. OVERRULED.

THE WITNESS: NO, I DIDN'T.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: AND WHEN YOU PULLED BACK DOWN TO THE ROCKINGHAM GATE AT 10:39, YOU RECALL YOUR TESTIMONY AT THAT POINT, YOU PULLED SO THAT THE SIDE -- THE DRIVER'S SIDE WINDOW WAS PARALLEL WITH THE DRIVEWAY. DO YOU RECALL TESTIFYING TO THAT, SIR?

A: YES.

Q: HOW CLOSE DID YOU PULL TO THE DRIVEWAY AT THAT POINT AT 10:39?

A: TEN FEET.

Q: WITHIN TEN FEET OF THE DRIVEWAY?

A: I WAS IN THE MIDDLE OF THE STREET, YES.

Q: SO YOU WERE NOT OVER ON THE RIGHT-HAND SIDE WHERE YOUR LANE OF TRAFFIC WOULD NEARLY BE? YOU WERE FARTHER OVER TO THE LEFT?

MR. COCHRAN: OBJECT TO THE FORM. IT IS LEADING AND SUGGESTIVE, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: ASK HIM TO DESCRIBE WHERE HE WAS.

MS. CLARK: OKAY.

Q: IN TERMS OF THE LANES OF TRAFFIC, IF YOU ARE DRIVING SOUTHBOUND ON ROCKINGHAM, YOUR LANE OF TRAFFIC WOULD BE TO WHAT SIDE OF THE STREET, SIR?

A: IT WOULD BE ON THE RIGHT.

Q: AND WERE YOU ALL THE WAY OVER ON THE RIGHT?

A: NO.

Q: WHERE WERE YOU?

A: TOWARD THE MIDDLE OF THE STREET.

Q: DID YOU HAVE TO VEER AROUND ANY WHITE FORD BRONCO PARKED AT THE CURB?

MR. COCHRAN: YOUR HONOR, I OBJECT TO THE FORM OF THAT QUESTION.

THE COURT: SUSTAIN. REPHRASE THE QUESTION.

MR. COCHRAN: MAY WE APPROACH?

THE COURT: I HAVE SUSTAINED THE OBJECTION.

MR. COCHRAN: YES. THANK YOU, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: WHEN YOU PULLED UP TO THE ROCKINGHAM DRIVEWAY, SIR, AND YOU LOOKED INTO THE GATE, WHEN YOU PULLED UP TO THAT LOCATION, WAS THE LOCATION IN WHICH YOU SEE THE WHITE FORD BRONCO ON THIS PHOTOGRAPH, WAS THAT AREA IN YOUR FIELD OF VIEW?

A: YES, IT WOULD HAVE BEEN.

Q: AND DID YOU SEE THE WHITE FORD BRONCO?

MR. COCHRAN: ASKED AND ANSWERED, YOUR HONOR.

THE WITNESS: NO, I DIDN'T.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: DID YOU TELL THAT TO THE POLICE WHEN YOU SPOKE TO THEM SHORTLY AFTER THE MURDERS OCCURRED?

A: YES.

Q: AND DID YOU TELL THAT TO THE GRAND JURY IN YOUR TESTIMONY AS WELL?

A: YES.

MR. COCHRAN: I OBJECT, YOUR HONOR. THAT MISSTATES THE EVIDENCE.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: WHEN YOU TESTIFIED BEFORE THE GRAND JURY DID YOU TELL THEM THAT WHEN YOU PULLED DOWN TO THE ROCKINGHAM GATE TO SEE IF YOU COULD PULL INTO THAT DRIVEWAY THAT YOU DID NOT SEE THE WHITE FORD BRONCO PARKED AT THE CURB?

MR. COCHRAN: YOUR HONOR, I OBJECT TO THE FORM OF THAT QUESTION. THE BEST EVIDENCE IS WHAT HE SAID AT THE GRAND JURY, NOT JUST PARAPHRASED.

MS. CLARK: FINE.

THE COURT: SUSTAINED.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

MS. CLARK: DIRECTING COUNSEL'S ATTENTION TO PAGE 252 OF THE GRAND JURY TRANSCRIPT.

MR. COCHRAN: WHAT LINE?

MS. CLARK: LINE 12 -- WELL, LINE 10. LET'S START WITH LINE 10. READY?

MR. COCHRAN: YES. I WOULD ASK YOU TO READ ALL THE WAY DOWN TO -- HOW FAR ARE YOU GOING TO READ DOWN?

MS. CLARK: I'M GOING TO READ ALL THE WAY DOWN.

MR. COCHRAN: RIGHT.

MS. CLARK: I WILL READ OVER TO PAGE 253.

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. PROCEED.

MS. CLARK: "QUESTION:" -- DO YOU RECALL THE FOLLOWING QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS BEFORE THE GRAND JURY BACK IN JUNE, 1994, SIR? QUESTION BY MYSELF. "AT WHAT POINT DID YOU GET BACK IN YOUR CAR, IF YOU DID? "ANSWER: I GOT BACK IN AT ABOUT 10:30 AND SAT THERE AND WAITED UNTIL ABOUT 10:40 AND THEN I PULLED UP TO THE FRONT GATE ON ASHFORD. "QUESTION: DID YOU GET BACK IN YOUR CAR AND DRIVE AROUND AT ANY POINT? "ANSWER: BEFORE -- BEFORE I PULLED INTO THE GATE ON ASHFORD I CAME OUT ONTO ROCKINGHAM. "QUESTION: HOW FAR DOWN ROCKINGHAM DID YOU COME? "ANSWER: I CAME ALL THE WAY DOWN TO THE GATE OF ROCKINGHAM.

"QUESTION: DID YOU NOTICE ANY CAR PARKED IN FRONT? "ANSWER: NO, I DID NOT. "QUESTION: THERE WASN'T ANY CAR THERE? "ANSWER: NO. "QUESTION: YOU WERE LOOKING THERE AND YOU WOULD HAVE SEEN IT? "ANSWER: YEAH, I WOULD HAVE SAW IT IF IT WAS THERE. "QUESTION: WHAT TIME WAS THAT? "ANSWER: THAT WAS JUST BEFORE 10:40. "QUESTION: ABOUT 10:35 OR SO? "YEAH. I THEN NOTICED THAT IT WOULD BE A LOT EASIER IF I JUST BACKED UP AND CAME BACK TO THE OTHER DRIVEWAY BECAUSE IT DIDN'T LOOK LIKE I WOULD BE ABLE TO MAKE THE TURN IN THE LIMOUSINE, SO I DROVE BACK TO THE OTHER GATE. "QUESTION: WHEN YOU SAY THE OTHER GATE, YOU MEAN THE ASHFORD GATE. "ANSWER: YES. "QUESTION: WHERE DID YOU PARK THAT TIME? "ANSWER: I PARKED FACE FIRST INTO THE DRIVEWAY LOOKING TOWARD THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE. "YOU PARKED RIGHT UP IN THE DRIVEWAY AREA JUST IN FRONT OF THE GATE? "ANSWER: YES, I DID. "QUESTION: AND YOU WERE FACING IN? "ANSWER: YES. "QUESTION: WHAT TIME WAS IT THEN? "ANSWER: 10:40."

Q: DO YOU RECALL GIVING THOSE ANSWERS TO THE QUESTIONS THAT I HAVE JUST READ TO YOU, SIR?

A: YES, I DO.

MS. CLARK: AND DIRECTING COUNSEL'S ATTENTION TO THE PRELIMINARY HEARING TRANSCRIPT, PAGES 15 AND 16.

MR. COCHRAN: WHAT LINE?

MS. CLARK: I WILL START WITH 12. WELL, ACTUALLY NO, LET ME BACK UP, COUNSEL. I'M GOING TO START AT -- I SHOULD START ON PAGE 14. I WILL START AT LINE 2, PAGE 14. OKAY.

MR. COCHRAN: I'M SORRY?

THE COURT: 14, LINE 2.

MS. CLARK: PAGE 14, LINE 2.

MR. COCHRAN: LINE 2. OKAY.

THE COURT: PROCEED.

MS. CLARK: READY? OKAY.

Q: I'M GOING TO ASK YOU IF THE QUESTIONS I'M ABOUT TO READ TO YOU AND THE ANSWERS ARE THOSE YOU RECALL BEING POSED TO YOU AND GIVEN BY YOU AT THE PRELIMINARY HEARING IN I BELIEVE IT WAS JULY OF 1994. OKAY. "QUESTION: SO WAS IT ABOUT 10:39 WHEN YOU PULLED DOWN TO THE ROCKINGHAM GATE? "ANSWER: YES, I WOULD SAY THAT. "QUESTION: WHEN YOU PULLED DOWN TO THE ROCKINGHAM GATE, YOU SAY YOU LOOKED DOWN THE DRIVEWAY? "ANSWER: YES. "QUESTION: WOULD THAT MEAN, SIR, THAT YOUR DRIVER'S SIDE WINDOW WAS PARALLEL TO THE DRIVEWAY? "ANSWER: YES, IT WAS. "QUESTION: AND SO YOU WERE RIGHT NEXT TO THIS AREA HERE THAT I AM INDICATING WITH MY PEN, WHICH IS JUST ABOVE THE LINE THAT SEEMS TO INDICATE THE EDGE OF THE DRIVEWAY UPPERMOST ON THE ROCKINGHAM GATE?"

MR. COCHRAN: ROCKINGHAM SIDE.

MS. CLARK: ROCKINGHAM SIDE, THANK YOU. "ANSWER: YES. "NOW, WHY WERE YOU LOOKING THAT UP DRIVEWAY? FOR WHAT PURPOSE? "ANSWER: TO DRIVE INTO IT. "QUESTION: AND WHY DID IT SEEM INACCESSIBLE TO YOU? "ANSWER: IT JUST SEEMED TOO NARROW, THE TWO WALLS HERE AND JUST THE WAY THE CARS WERE AND THE WAY THE DRIVEWAY BENT THIS WAY, IT DIDN'T LOOK AS EASY AS THE OTHER SIDE AS COMING IN STRAIGHT AHEAD AND THEN MAKING THE TURN. "QUESTION: SO IT LOOKED A LITTLE BIT TOO TIGHT TO GET UP TO THE FRONT DOOR FROM THAT GATE? "ANSWER: YES. "SO YOU WERE LOOKING CAREFULLY THROUGH THAT WINDOW TO ASSESS WHETHER OR NOT YOU COULD MAKE THE TURN? "ANSWER: YEAH. "QUESTION: DID YOU NOTICE ANY WHITE FORD BRONCO PARKED ON THE ROCKINGHAM SIDE NEAR THE GATE? "ANSWER: NO, I DIDN'T. "QUESTION: WOULD YOU HAVE SEEN IT HAD IT BEEN PARKED THERE NEXT TO THE GATE? "GIVEN THE MANNER IN WHICH YOU WERE LOOKING AT THAT LOCATION" --

MR. COCHRAN: I THINK THERE WAS AN OBJECTION.

MS. CLARK: STRIKE THAT QUESTION.

MR. COCHRAN: STRIKE THAT LAST QUESTION.

MS. CLARK: STRIKE THAT. BUT THIS ONE WAS OKAY. "GIVEN THE MANNER IN WHICH YOU WERE LOOKING AT THAT LOCATION WHEN YOU PULLED UP TO THE ROCKINGHAM GATE, WOULD THAT WHITE FORD BRONCO HAVE BEEN RIGHT IN YOUR FIELD OF VIEW? "ANSWER: I WOULDN'T SAY I WAS -- IT WAS RIGHT IN MY EXACT SIGHT IF -- "QUESTION: WAS IT IN YOUR FIELD OF VIEW WHERE YOU WERE LOOKING? "NO, TOWARDS -- "QUESTION: TOWARD THE DRIVEWAY WAS THAT AREA -- LET ME INDICATE WITH MY PEN. WERE YOU ABLE TO SEE THIS AREA AS YOU WERE LOOKING UP THE DRIVEWAY? "ANSWER: YES, I WAS."

AND FOR THE RECORD, I INDICATED THE AREA JUST ABOVE THE LINE WHICH WOULD HAVE BEEN JUST TO THE NORTH OF THE ROCKINGHAM GATE. "OKAY. WERE YOU ABLE TO SEE THIS AREA? "ANSWER: YES, I WAS. "AS YOU WERE LOOKING DOWN THE DRIVEWAY COULD YOU SEE THIS AREA THAT I AM INDICATING WITH YOUR PEN? "ANSWER: YES. "QUESTION: AND YOU DID NOT SEE THE WHITE FORD BRONCO? "ANSWER: NO, I DIDN'T. "NOW, THAT WAS 10:40 APPROXIMATELY OR 10:39 YOU SAID? "ANSWER: YES. "QUESTION: AND THEN WHAT DID YOU DO AFTER YOU PULLED UP TO THE ROCKINGHAM GATE YOU INDICATED? "ANSWER: I BACKED STRAIGHT BACK UP AND MADE ANOTHER LEFT ONTO ASHFORD AND CAME UP TO THIS GATE, THE ASHFORD GATE." AND THEN -- I BETTER FINISH IT. "QUESTION: WHERE DID YOU PARK WHEN YOU CAME BACK TO THE ASHFORD SIDE? "I PULLED IN FRONTWARD IN THE LIMOUSINE, AND YOU KNOW, THE FRONT BUMPER WAS JUST ABOUT TOUCHING THE GATE. "QUESTION: SO AT THAT POINT WAS THE FRONT OF YOUR LIMO POINTING INTO THE DRIVEWAY? "ANSWER: YES, IT WAS. "QUESTION: AND WHAT TIME WAS IT AT THAT POINT WHEN YOU PULLED UP TO THE GATE FACING INTO THE DRIVEWAY ON THE ASHFORD SIDE? "ANSWER: ABOUT 10:40."

Q: DO YOU RECALL THOSE QUESTIONS AND THOSE ANSWERS HAVING BEEN GIVEN TO YOU TO THOSE QUESTIONS AT THE PRELIMINARY HEARING IN THIS MATTER IN 1994?

A: YES, I DO.

Q: SO WHEN YOU PULLED -- NOW, WHEN YOU PULLED OUT OF THE ROCKINGHAM GATE ON YOUR WAY TO THE AIRPORT, I BELIEVE YOU INDICATED YOU RECALL SOME OBSTRUCTION TO THE RIGHT?

MR. COCHRAN: OBJECTED TO, YOUR HONOR. LEADING AND SUGGESTIVE; NOT JUST FOUNDATIONAL.

MS. CLARK: HOW COULD IT BE LEADING IF HE HAS ALREADY TESTIFIED TO IT?

THE COURT: OVERRULED. OVERRULED.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: MR. PARK?

A: YES.

Q: DO YOU RECALL WHETHER THAT WAS -- WHAT THAT OBSTRUCTION WAS?

A: NO, I DON'T.

Q: SO AT THIS TIME DO YOU EVEN KNOW WHETHER IT WAS A CAR PARKED OR ANYTHING ELSE TO THE RIGHT OF YOU?

A: NO, I DON'T.

Q: ALL RIGHT. NOW, YOU INDICATED, SIR, THAT YOU SAW THIS SIX-FOOT 200-POUND AFRICAN AMERICAN PERSON IN ALL DARK CLOTHING WALK INTO THE ENTRANCE OF ROCKINGHAM. DO YOU RECALL THAT?

A: YES.

Q: AND YOU SAID THAT WAS BETWEEN 10:54 AND 10:55?

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS.)

THE COURT: I HAVE A QUESTION PENDING WITH NO ANSWER.

MS. CLARK: I AM WAITING FOR A PHOTOGRAPH I WANTED TO SHOW HIM.

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS.)

MS. CLARK: GREAT.

Q: OKAY. CAN YOU INDICATE ON THIS PHOTOGRAPH, SIR -- I'M GOING TO ASK YOU TO --

MR. COCHRAN: YOUR HONOR, MAY WE APPROACH FOR A MOMENT?

MS. CLARK: I'M GOING TO ASK YOU TO DIRECT THE -- I'M SORRY.

THE COURT: FOR WHAT PURPOSE?

MR. COCHRAN: MAY WE APPROACH A MINUTE?

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. WITHOUT THE REPORTER.

(A CONFERENCE WAS HELD AT THE BENCH, NOT REPORTED.)

(THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT:)

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. COUNSEL, PROCEED. WE ARE WASTING TIME HERE.

MS. CLARK: I DIDN'T ASK FOR A SIDE BAR.

THE COURT: I KNOW, BUT YOU DON'T HAVE TO STAND THERE EITHER, BOTH OF YOU. PROCEED. THIS IS PEOPLE'S 139?

MS. CLARK: PEOPLE'S 139.

Q: COULD YOU PLEASE INDICATE, IF YOU WOULD, SIR, DIRECT THAT ARROW, IF YOU CAN FIND IT, ON THIS PHOTOGRAPH WHERE YOU FIRST SAW THE PERSON YOU DESCRIBED WALKING INTO THE HOUSE BETWEEN 10:54 AND 10:55?

A: IT WOULD HAVE BEEN UP JUST TO THE CORNER OF THOSE POTTED PLANTS. UP A LITTLE FARTHER. THERE YOU GO. GO BACK. AROUND THERE, (INDICATING).

Q: WAS IT -- IT WASN'T ON THEM?

A: WELL, IN THAT AREA, MAYBE A LITTLE BIT CLOSER TO THE DOOR. THERE YOU GO, (INDICATING).

Q: THERE?

MR. COCHRAN: CLOSER TO THE DOOR, YOUR HONOR, HE SAID.

THE COURT: IT WAS JUST MOVED CLOSER TO THE DOOR AND OFF THE POT.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: IS THAT --

A: THAT IS THE GENERAL AREA, YES.

MS. CLARK: MARK THAT. HAVE THIS MARKED AS PEOPLE'S 139-A.

(PEO'S 139-A FOR ID = PHOTOGRAPH)

MR. COCHRAN: YOUR HONOR, CAN WE ASK THE WITNESS IF THAT IS WHERE HE WOULD PLACE IT?

MS. CLARK: THAT IS WHAT HE SAID.

THE COURT: ASK HIM AGAIN.

MS. CLARK: ALL RIGHT.

Q: WHERE THAT WHITE ARROW IS; IS THAT CORRECT, SIR?

A: YOU COULD GO CLOSER TO THE FRONT OF THE DOOR.

MS. CLARK: OKAY. LET'S MOVE IT.

THE WITNESS: THAT WOULD BE GOOD, (INDICATING).

MS. CLARK: ALL RIGHT. PEOPLE'S 139-B.

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. 139-B.

MS. CLARK: THANK YOU.

(PEO'S 139-B FOR ID = PHOTOGRAPH)

Q: BY MS. CLARK: WHEN YOU SAW THAT PERSON WALK INTO THE DOOR, SIR, WERE YOU ABLE -- DID YOU SEE THE HEM OF A ROBE SWIRLING AROUND THE LEGS AT ALL?

MR. COCHRAN: OBJECT TO THAT, YOUR HONOR. ARGUMENTATIVE. SPECULATIVE, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

MR. COCHRAN: ASSUMES A FACT NOT IN EVIDENCE.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

THE WITNESS: NO.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: OKAY. DID YOU SEE THAT PERSON SWINGING A GOLF CLUB?

A: NO.

Q: CARRYING A GOLF CLUB?

A: NO.

Q: NOW, YOU INDICATED THAT AFTER THAT PERSON ENTERED THE HOUSE YOU SAW THE LIGHTS GO ON?

A: CORRECT.

MR. COCHRAN: ASKED AND ANSWERED, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: WHEN YOU -- ULTIMATELY AT SOME POINT YOU PULLED UP TO THE -- YOU PULLED INSIDE?

A: YES.

Q: CORRECT. BEFORE YOU PULLED INSIDE, SIR, YOU INDICATED YOU SPOKE TO THE DEFENDANT OVER THE INTERCOM?

A: YES.

Q: DID HE BUZZ YOU IN?

A: (NO AUDIBLE RESPONSE.)

MR. COCHRAN: ASKED AND ANSWERED, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

THE WITNESS: NO.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: IT WAS KATO THAT LET YOU IN?

A: FROM WHAT I REMEMBER, YES.

Q: OKAY. AFTER YOU GOT IN AND YOU PARKED -- YOU SAID AT SOME POINT YOU SAW THE DEFENDANT COME DOWNSTAIRS, COME OUT THE FRONT DOOR?

A: YES.

Q: DID YOU LOOK AT YOUR WATCH TO SEE WHAT TIME IT WAS WHEN HE CAME DOWNSTAIRS?

A: NO, I DIDN'T.

Q: YOU ESTIMATED FOR US THAT IT WAS FIVE TO SIX MINUTES BETWEEN THE TIME YOU SPOKE TO THE DEFENDANT -- EXCUSE ME. STRIKE THAT. YOU INDICATED TO US YESTERDAY THAT IT WAS FIVE TO SIX MINUTES, I BELIEVE, BETWEEN THE TIME YOU SAW THE SIX-FOOT 200-POUND PERSON GO INTO THE HOUSE AND THE TIME YOU SAW THE DEFENDANT COME OUTSIDE?

A: YES.

Q: DO YOU RECALL THAT?

A: YES, I DO.

Q: YOU DID NOT LOOK AT YOUR WATCH WHEN HE -- WHEN THE DEFENDANT CAME OUTSIDE, THAT FIVE TO SIX-MINUTE TIME FRAME?

MR. COCHRAN: OBJECTION.

THE COURT: SUSTAINED. REPHRASE THE QUESTION.

MS. CLARK: THAT FIVE TO SIX-MINUTE TIME -- TIME FRAME YOU GAVE US BETWEEN THE TIME YOU SAW THE SIX-FOOT 200-POUND PERSON GO INSIDE AND YOU SAW THE DEFENDANT COME OUTSIDE, IS THAT APPROXIMATE OR IS THAT EXACT?

A: THAT IS ESTIMATED TIME. THAT IS A GUESSTIMATE YOU COULD SAY.

Q: A GUESSTIMATE?

A: YEAH.

MS. CLARK: COULD I GET 138? (DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS.)

Q: BY MS. CLARK: LET ME SHOW YOU PEOPLE'S 138, SIR. NO, WAIT. YOU KNOW WHAT --

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS.)

Q: BY MS. CLARK: FIRST I WANT TO SHOW YOU PEOPLE'S 112. I BELIEVE YOU INDICATED ON CROSS-EXAMINATION THAT YOU RECOGNIZED THIS FOYER AREA OF THE DEFENDANT'S RESIDENCE?

A: YES, I DO.

Q: YOU INDICATED ALSO THAT YOU SAW THE DEFENDANT AND KATO SPEAKING TOGETHER JUST INSIDE THE HOUSE SHORTLY BEFORE YOU LEFT FOR THE AIRPORT. DO YOU RECALL THAT?

A: YES.

Q: DO YOU SEE THE AREA IN THIS PHOTOGRAPH WHERE THEY STOOD TALKING FOR A BIT?

A: YEAH, THAT IS THE AREA.

Q: IN THAT FOYER?

A: YES.

Q: NOW, WHEN YOU WERE --

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS.)

Q: BY MS. CLARK: LET ME ASK YOU A COUPLE QUESTIONS BEFORE WE GET -- THIS IS PEOPLE'S 138. YOU RECALL THE FRONT PLAY AND LAWN AREA IN THE -- INSIDE THE -- INSIDE THE GATES OF THE DEFENDANT'S RESIDENCE?

A: I DIDN'T KNOW WHAT IT WAS AT THE TIME, NO.

Q: OKAY.

A: I MEAN --

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS.)

Q: BY MS. CLARK: ALL RIGHT. DO YOU SEE THE AREA ON THIS DIAGRAM THAT HAS PREVIOUSLY BEEN MARKED AS PEOPLE'S 66, BUT NOW IT IS ON THE SCREEN THERE IS DESIGNATED "LAWN."

A: YES.

Q: AND "PLAY YARD"?

A: YES.

Q: CAN YOU TELL US WHAT THE LIGHTING WAS LIKE IN THAT AREA THAT NIGHT?

MR. COCHRAN: YOUR HONOR, THIS HAS BEEN ASKED AND ANSWERED ON DIRECT EXAMINATION.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

THE WITNESS: IT WAS VERY DARK.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: AND CAN YOU TELL US, SIR, WHETHER YOU SAW ANY GOLF BALLS IN THAT LAWN AREA THAT NIGHT?

A: NO.

Q: LET ME ASK YOU ALSO, SIR, WERE YOU LOOKING ON THE -- WERE YOU LOOKING DOWN AT THE DRIVEWAY AND ON THE GROUND TO SEE IF THERE WERE ANY SPOTS ON THE GROUND THAT NIGHT?

A: NO.

Q: AND WAS -- CAN YOU TELL US WHAT THE LIGHTING IN THE DRIVEWAY WAS LIKE, IN GENERAL?

A: IT -- IT WAS DIM. THERE WASN'T VERY MUCH LIGHT.

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS.)

MS. CLARK: ALL RIGHT. BACK TO PEOPLE'S 138.

Q: OKAY. YOU INDICATED PREVIOUSLY THAT YOU SAW A SMALL DARK BAG SOME -- BEHIND THE BENTLEY OR THE ROLLS ROYCE OR BEHIND THE CARS, I'M SORRY. DO YOU RECALL SAYING THAT?

A: YES.

Q: CAN YOU SEE THE AREA ON THIS PHOTOGRAPH, PEOPLE'S 138, WHERE YOU SAW THAT BAG?

MR. COCHRAN: YOUR HONOR, THIS HAS BEEN ASKED AND ANSWERED AND WE HAVE AN EXHIBIT MARKED WITH THAT AREA ON IT.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: GO AHEAD.

A: IT IS JUST TO THE LOWER LEFT CORNER IN THAT PICTURE.

Q: WHY DON'T YOU DIRECT THE ARROW.

A: STRAIGHT. GO BACK TOWARDS -- JUST DOWN TOWARDS THE CORNER. SOMEWHERE AROUND THERE, (INDICATING).

MS. CLARK: OKAY. 138-C. 138-C, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. 138-C.

(PEO'S 138-C FOR ID = PHOTOGRAPH)

Q: BY MS. CLARK: ALL RIGHT. NOW, THAT BAG, SIR, YOU INDICATED, I BELIEVE YESTERDAY, THAT GOLF CLUBS WERE PLACED INTO THE TRUNK, THE GARMENT BAG WAS PLACED INTO THE TRUNK, AND THEN THERE WERE TWO BLACK DUFFLE BAGS THAT WENT INTO THE PASSENGER COMPARTMENT?

MR. COCHRAN: MISSTATES THE EVIDENCE, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

THE WITNESS: YES.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: DID THE DEFENDANT LOAD ANY OF THOSE BAGS INTO THE TRUNK OR THE PASSENGER COMPARTMENT?

MR. COCHRAN: OBJECT TO THE FORM OF THAT QUESTION, YOUR HONOR. IT IS VAGUE. I DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

THE WITNESS: NOT FROM WHAT I REMEMBER.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: BUT THAT KNAPSACK -- THAT SMALL BAG THAT YOU JUST INDICATED ON THIS PHOTOGRAPH, DID YOU LOAD THAT INTO THE CAR?

A: NO, I DIDN'T.

Q: AFTER THE DEFENDANT PICKED IT UP, DID YOU EVER -- PICKED IT UP FROM THAT LOCATION, DID YOU EVER SEE IT AGAIN?

A: NO.

Q: NOW, YOU INDICATED THAT ONE OF THE DUFFLE BAGS WAS UNZIPPED?

A: YES.

Q: COULD YOU TELL WHETHER THAT DUFFEL BAG WAS EMPTY OR FULL?

A: IT WASN'T EMPTY AND IT WASN'T FULL.

Q: DID YOU LOOK INSIDE IT TO SEE WHAT WAS IN IT?

A: NO.

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS.)

Q: BY MS. CLARK: AND THAT SMALL DARK BAG THAT THE DEFENDANT PICKED UP FROM THE LOCATION SHOWN IN THIS PHOTOGRAPH, HAVE YOU SEEN THAT BAG IN COURT TODAY?

A: WHICH ONE?

Q: THE SMALL DARK BAG THAT YOU SAW ON THE DRIVEWAY?

MR. COCHRAN: JUST A MOMENT, YOUR HONOR. OBJECT. MAY WE APPROACH? MAY WE APPROACH?

THE COURT: NO. I'M GOING TO SUSTAIN THE OBJECTION.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: OKAY. YOU INDICATED ONE OF THE DUFFLE BAGS WAS UNZIPPED. DO YOU RECALL THAT?

A: YES.

Q: AND THAT DUFFEL BAG WENT INTO THE PASSENGER COMPARTMENT IN THE REAR AREA OF THE CAR?

A: YES, IT DID.

Q: AND COULD THAT SMALL DARK BAG THAT YOU SAW THAT YOU HAVE INDICATED THE POSITION OF IN THIS PHOTOGRAPH, PEOPLE'S 138, COULD THAT SMALL DARK BAG HAVE FIT INTO THE DUFFEL BAG?

MR. COCHRAN: OBJECT, YOUR HONOR. CALLS FOR SPECULATION.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

THE WITNESS: I DON'T KNOW.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: WAS IT SMALLER THAN THE DUFFEL BAG?

A: I SAW IT FROM A DISTANCE, SO I DON'T KNOW EXACTLY HOW BIG IT WAS.

Q: WAS IT SMALLER THAN THE DUFFEL BAG?

MR. COCHRAN: ASKED AND ANSWERED, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

THE WITNESS: IT SEEMED TO BE SMALLER.

THE COURT: MISS CLARK, DO YOU HAVE MUCH MORE?

MS. CLARK: NO, I DON'T, YOUR HONOR.

Q: AND THAT SMALL DARK BAG, COULD THAT HAVE BEEN IN THE BACKSEAT WITH THE DEFENDANT?

A: YES.

Q: NOW, THAT GARMENT BAG -- CAN WE HAVE THAT BACK? I THINK IF I CAN JUST HAVE FIVE MINUTES, YOUR HONOR, I WILL BE DONE.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

Q: BY MS. CLARK: FIRST OF ALL, MR. PART, WHEN YOU SAW THE GARMENT BAG ON JUNE THE 12TH YOU PICKED IT UP, DID YOU?

A: YES.

Q: YOU LOADED IT INTO THE TRUNK?

A: YES.

Q: DID IT SEEM TO CONTAIN CLOTHING?

A: YES.

MR. COCHRAN: JUST A MOMENT, YOUR HONOR. THAT IS SPECULATIVE.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

THE WITNESS: IT SEEMED TO HAVE SOMETHING IN IT.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: HAVE YOU LOOKED IN THIS BAG TODAY, SIR?

A: NO, I HAVEN'T.

Q: UNZIPPING IT. I'M GOING TO ASK YOU TO TELL US, DO YOU SEE ANY CLOTHING IN IT NOW?

A: NO.

Q: DO YOU KNOW WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CLOTHING THAT WAS IN IT ON THE NIGHT OF JUNE THE 12TH?

A: NO.

Q: DO YOU KNOW WHERE THIS BAG HAS BEEN SINCE JUNE THE 12TH?

A: NO.

Q: DO YOU KNOW WHAT HAPPENED TO THE ITEMS THAT WERE INSIDE IT?

A: NO.

Q: DID YOU SEE THE CONTENTS OF THAT BAG ON THE NIGHT OF JUNE THE 12TH?

A: NO.

Q: AND THE GOLF BAG THAT YOU WERE SHOWN, I BELIEVE YOU INDICATED THAT EXTERIOR DIDN'T LOOK LIKE THE EXTERIOR YOU RECALL SEEING ON THE NIGHT OF JUNE THE 12TH? DO YOU RECALL THAT?

A: YES.

Q: SO DO YOU THINK IT WAS SOME OTHER KIND OF EXTERIOR THAT WAS OVER THE GOLF BAG THAT NIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: AND THAT EXTERIOR PART, THAT SHEATH THAT YOU ARE DESCRIBING, WAS THAT THE PART THAT YOU ACTUALLY HAD CONTACT WITH WHEN YOU GAVE IT TO THE SKYCAP AND SAW IT IN THE TRUNK?

A: YES.

Q: AND THIS BLACK DUFFEL BAG, SIR, DID IT APPEAR TO HAVE SOMETHING IN IT ON THE NIGHT OF JUNE THE 12TH WHEN YOU LOADED IT INTO THE PASSENGER AREA OF THE LIMOUSINE?

A: YES.

Q: DO YOU SEE ANYTHING IN IT NOW, SIR?

A: NO.

Q: DO YOU KNOW WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CONTENTS OF THAT BAG?

MR. COCHRAN: YOUR HONOR, THOSE ARE CLEARLY IMPROPER QUESTIONS AND COUNSEL KNOWS IT.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

THE WITNESS: NO.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: DO YOU KNOW WHERE THAT BAG HAS BEEN SINCE JUNE THE 12TH, SIR?

A: I HAVE NO IDEA.

Q: OR WHAT HAPPENED TO THE CONTENTS OF THE BAG THAT WERE THERE ON JUNE THE 12TH?

A: NO IDEA.

Q: WHEN THE DEFENDANT GOT OUT OF THE LIMOUSINE AT THE AIRPORT, SIR, WERE THERE ANY BAGS -- ANY OF HIS BAGS LEFT IN THE PASSENGER COMPARTMENT?

A: NO.

Q: WERE THERE ANY OF HIS BAGS LEFT IN THE TRUNK?

A: NO.

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS.)

MS. CLARK: I HAVE NOTHING FURTHER.

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. I TAKE IT YOU DO HAVE SOME RECROSS?

MR. COCHRAN: YES, I HAVE SOME.

THE COURT: OKAY.

MR. COCHRAN: WOULD YOU LIKE ME TO DO IT NOW?

THE COURT: NO. WE ARE GOING TO TAKE A RECESS AT THIS POINT. ALL RIGHT.

LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, WE ARE GOING TO TAKE A RECESS AT THIS POINT. PLEASE REMEMBER MY ADMONITIONS TO YOU. DON'T DISCUSS THE CASE AMONGST YOURSELVES, FORM ANY OPINIONS ABOUT THE CASE, CONDUCT MY DELIBERATIONS OR ALLOW ANYBODY TO CONTACT YOU. WE WILL BE IN RECESS UNTIL 1:30. I WOULD LIKE COUNSEL HERE AT 1:30. MR. PARK, YOU ARE EXCUSED UNTIL 1:30. ALL RIGHT. PLEASE REMEMBER MY OTHER ORDERS.

THE WITNESS: THANK YOU, YOUR HONOR.

MR. DARDEN: MAY WE APPROACH FOR A MOMENT?

THE COURT: SURE.

(A CONFERENCE WAS HELD AT THE BENCH, NOT REPORTED.)

(AT 12:08 P.M. THE NOON RECESS WAS TAKEN UNTIL 1:30 P.M. OF THE SAME DAY.)

LOS ANGELES, CALIFORNIA; WEDNESDAY, MARCH 29, 1995 2:04 P.M.

DEPARTMENT NO. 103 HON. LANCE A. ITO, JUDGE

APPEARANCES: (APPEARANCES AS HERETOFORE NOTED, MS. CLARK NOT BEING PRESENT; ALSO PRESENT REPRESENTING THE DEFENDANT, ROBERT D. BLASIER, BARRY SCHECK, PETER NEUFELD AND WILLIAM C. THOMPSON; ALSO REPRESENTING THE PEOPLE, WILLIAM W. HODGMAN, CHERI A. LEWIS, ROCKNE P. HARMON, GEORGE W. CLARKE, HANK M. GOLDBERG AND ALAN YOCHELSON.)

(JANET M. MOXHAM, CSR NO. 4855, OFFICIAL REPORTER.)

(CHRISTINE M. OLSON, CSR NO. 2378, OFFICIAL REPORTER.)

(THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT, OUT OF THE PRESENCE OF THE JURY:)

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. ANYTHING ELSE WE NEED TO DISCUSS BEFORE WE HAVE THE JURORS REJOIN US?

MR. COCHRAN: JUST ONE MOMENT.

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN DEFENSE COUNSEL AND THE DEFENDANT.)

MR. DARDEN: WE HAVE TO WAIT FOR --

MR. COCHRAN: MAY WE APPROACH, YOUR HONOR, JUST A MOMENT?

MR. DARDEN: WITH THE REPORTER?

MR. COCHRAN: WELL, I WILL LET THE JUDGE DECIDE.

MR. DARDEN: IS IT RELATIVE -- RELATES TO THAT ITEM.

(A CONFERENCE WAS HELD AT THE BENCH, NOT REPORTED.)

(THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT:)

THE COURT: BACK ON THE RECORD IN THE SIMPSON MATTER. ALL PARTIES ARE AGAIN PRESENT, WITH THE EXCEPTION OF MISS CLARK. MR. COCHRAN, YOU WISH TO BE HEARD?

MR. COCHRAN: I WOULD LIKE TO BE HEARD IF I MIGHT. I WOULD ASK LEAVE THE COURT TO ASK MR. PARK A QUESTION REGARDING THIS PARTICULAR BAG, WHICH I WOULD LIKE TO MARK AND ASK HIM WHETHER OR NOT THIS PARTICULAR BAG I HAVE IN MY LEFT HAND HERE APPEARS SIMILAR IN SIZE AND SHAPE AND COLOR TO THE BAG THAT HE SAW FROM ABOUT TWENTY FEET ON THE DRIVEWAY. I THINK THAT THIS BAG BELONGED TO OR BELONGS TO MR. SIMPSON AND MAY HAVE BEEN ONE OF THE BAGS THAT HE TOOK TO CHICAGO ON THAT NIGHT. AND I THINK THE COURT IS AWARE ALSO THAT MR. PARK HAS PREVIOUSLY SEEN THIS BAG AND INDICATED THAT IT APPARENTLY IS -- COMPORTS OR IS SIMILAR IN SIZE AND SHAPE AND COLOR TO THE BAG THAT HE SAW FROM SOME TWENTY FEET AWAY. HE CAN'T SAY DEFINITELY. AND I ASK LEAVE THE COURT, IN VIEW OF THE TACT TAKEN BY THE PROSECUTION REGARDING THIS BAG, TO BE ALLOWED TO ASK THAT QUESTION IN THE PRESENCE OF THE JURY.

THE COURT: MR. DARDEN.

MR. DARDEN: WELL, AS I UNDERSTOOD THE OFFER OF PROOF COUNSEL MADE AT SIDE BAR IS THAT MR. SIMPSON SAID THAT THE BAG MIGHT HAVE BEEN A BAG HE TOOK TO CHICAGO, HE DOESN'T KNOW, HE CAN'T SAY FOR SURE. HE THINKS IT IS HIS BAG. HE HAS A LOT OF BAGS. WELL, THAT DOESN'T GIVE -- THAT IS NO OFFER OF PROOF. THAT IS NOT MUCH MORE THAN SPECULATION. IT IS A COMPLETE NON-COMMITTAL ON THE PART OF THE DEFENSE AS TO WHETHER OR NOT THAT BAG IS THE ONE THAT WAS TAKEN TO CHICAGO, AND THEY OUGHT NOT TO JUST THROW THINGS UP HERE IN FRONT OF THIS WITNESS.

MR. COCHRAN: YOUR HONOR, MAY THE WITNESS BE ASKED TO STEP OUTSIDE?

THE COURT: NO. HE HAS ALREADY BEEN INTERVIEWED IN THE PRESENCE OF COUNSEL.

(MS. CLARK ENTERS THE COURTROOM.)

MR. DARDEN: IT IS LITTLE MORE THAN TRICKERY. BEYOND THAT, THE BAG IS NEW AND IT IS APPARENT THAT NOTHING HAS EVER BEEN PLACED INSIDE THE BAG. THE KEYS ARE STILL ATTACHED TO THE BAG AND THE LITTLE PLASTIC STRING THAT ONCE -- TO WHICH WAS ONCE ATTACHED THE PRICE TAG I GUESS IS STILL ON THE BAG. THE BAG WAS RECOVERED JUST TODAY, I BELIEVE AT ELEVEN O'CLOCK THIS MORNING, FROM MR. KARDASHIAN'S HOME.

THE COURT: YESTERDAY.

MR. DARDEN: I'M SORRY.

THE COURT: YESTERDAY.

MR. DARDEN: YESTERDAY. IT IS IRRELEVANT. IT IS COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT. THIS BAG HAS -- HELPS US, IT DOES NOT HELP THE JURY --

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS.)

MR. DARDEN: AND AS MISS CLARK HAS REMINDED ME THERE COULD BE MILLIONS OF BAGS THAT PERHAPS FIT THE DESCRIPTION GIVEN BY MR. PARK, AND MR. PARK HAS TOLD THE COURT AT SIDE BAR AND HE HAS TOLD THE JURY AS WELL THAT HE DID NOT GET A GOOD LOOK AT THE BAG. HIS MEMORY IS SOMEWHAT VAGUE AS TO WHAT THE BAG LOOKED LIKE EXACTLY. I MEAN, IT COULD BE, IT COULDN'T BE. WHERE DOES THAT GET US? HOW IS THAT RELEVANT? SO WE WOULD OBJECT TO REPRESENTING THAT BAG TO THE JURY.

MR. COCHRAN: THE IDEA THAT IT IS VERY HARD FOR THE PROSECUTORS TO EVER ARGUE EVERYTHING WITHOUT LABELING EVERYTHING. TRICKERY COMES FROM THESE VAGUE THEORIES THAT CHANGE LIKE THE WEATHER.

MR. DARDEN: OBJECTION. IS THAT NOT A GRATUITOUS PERSONAL ATTACK?

MR. COCHRAN: I'M REFERRING TO HIS REMARK ABOUT TRICKERY.

THE COURT: COUNSEL, STOP, BOTH OF YOU.

MR. COCHRAN: YOUR HONOR, IF THE COURT PLEASES, I'M ASKING LEAVE OF THE COURT, BASED ON THE REPRESENTATION AND BASED UPON THE FACT THAT THIS BAG WAS RECOVERED BY JUDGE WONG YESTERDAY -- AND I WANT TO ASK MR. WONG ABOUT IT. YOUR HONOR, THIS MATTER WAS BROUGHT UP -- COULD MR. DARDEN PLEASE SIT DOWN AND STOP MAKING SOUNDS.

MR. DARDEN: WAS I MAKING SOUNDS?

MR. COCHRAN: YES. YOU WERE GOING "UN, UN, UN."

MR. DARDEN: NO, I WAS GOING "UN, UMM, UN."

MR. COCHRAN: THAT NERVOUS TWITCH.

THE COURT: I THINK WAS "UN, UN, UN."

MR. COCHRAN: "UN, UN, UN," YOUR HONOR.

MR. DARDEN: I COULDN'T BELIEVE WHAT MR. COCHRAN WAS SAYING.

MR. COCHRAN: NOW, YOUR HONOR, MAY I PROCEED? WITH REGARD TO THE PROSECUTION'S QUESTIONING OF BOTH MR. PARK AND MR. KATO KAELIN, IN THIS INSTANCE THESE BAGS, ALL THESE BAGS WERE RECOVERED. THEY WERE NOT RECOVERED BY THE PEOPLE. THESE BAGS WERE BROUGHT FORWARD BY THE DEFENSE WITH THE HELP OF THIS COURT BY THE SPECIAL MASTER AND THEY ARE NOW IN THE COURT'S CUSTODY. I WANT PURELY TO ASK THE QUESTION THE COURT KNOWS THAT I WANT TO ASK. I HAVE ASKED MR. PARK. I GUESS PROBATIVE VALUE. IT DOESN'T GO TO ANY WEIGHT. IT DOESN'T GO TO ADMISSIBILITY, RATHER, IT GOES TO ANY WEIGHT. EVERYBODY KNOWS HE WAS TWENTY FEET AWAY. HE WAS TWENTY FEET AWAY WHEN THEY WERE ASKING ALL THOSE QUESTIONS, TOO, BUT FAIR IS FAIR. YOU CAN'T ALLOW THEM, IT SEEMS TO ME, TO DO ALL THESE THINGS AND NOT ALLOW US AN OPPORTUNITY TO SHOW WHAT MIGHT VERY WELL HAVE BEEN THE BAG. AND THAT IS ALL WE ARE ASKING TO DO YOUR HONOR. I THINK IT IS ENTIRELY APPROPRIATE. WITH REGARD TO THE OTHER BAG HE CAN'T IDENTIFY, I'M NOT ASKING ANYTHING REGARDING THAT AND I WOULD LIKE TO CONCLUDED MY CROSS-EXAMINATION WITH THAT.

THE COURT: MR. DARDEN.

MR. DARDEN: THIS OFFER OF PROOF DOES NOT RISE TO THE LEVEL OF WHAT VERY WELL MIGHT HAVE BEEN. MR. SIMPSON KNOWS WHICH BAG HE TOOK TO CHICAGO. HE HASN'T SAID THAT THIS IS THE ONE, AND GIVEN THAT, THE DEFENSE SHOULD BE PRECLUDED FROM JUST THROWING THINGS UP HERE IN FRONT OF THE WITNESSES WHEN THEY THROW THEORIES AROUND THE COURTROOM, REGARDLESS OF WHETHER THEY HAVE A FACTUAL BASIS FOR THEM, AND NOW THEY WANT TO DO THE SAME THING WITH THIS BAG. IT IS IRRELEVANT. IT HAS NO PROBATIVE VALUE WHATSOEVER. MR. COCHRAN IS MAKING SOUNDS BEHIND MY BACK, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. GENTLEMEN.

MR. DARDEN: IN ANY EVENT --

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU. I'M GOING TO SUSTAIN THE 352 OBJECTION FOR THIS REASON: THE OFFER OF PROOF WAS THIS COULD POSSIBLY BE AND THE STATEMENT BY MR. PARK WITH COUNSEL AT SIDE BAR "THAT DOES NOT LOOK FAMILIAR," BUT HE COULDN'T TELL, YOU HAVE -- IT IS TOO SPECULATIVE AT THIS POINT AND THE DANGER OF MISLEADING THE JURY IS APPARENT. AND THE COURT WILL SUSTAIN THE OBJECTION.

MR. COCHRAN: YOUR HONOR, MAY I BE HEARD? MY UNDERSTANDING REGARDING WHAT MR. PARK SAID -- MY UNDERSTANDING MR. PARK -- AND I WOULD ASK THE COURT TO ASK HIM WHAT HE SAID -- WAS THAT IT WAS SIMILAR IN BOTH SIZE, SHAPE AND COLOR AND THAT HE WAS TWENTY FEET AWAY.

THE COURT: HIS INITIAL COMMENT TO ME WAS IT DOESN'T LOOK FAMILIAR.

MR. COCHRAN: BUT HE DID ALSO SAY --

THE COURT: COUNSEL, I'VE GOT EIGHT BAGS IN MY CHAMBERS THAT ARE THE SAME GENERAL COLOR, GENERAL SIZE.

MR. COCHRAN: EIGHT?

THE COURT: EIGHT. DO YOU WANT TO COUNT THEM?

MR. COCHRAN: NO, NO, I DON'T NEED TO COUNT THEM, BUT I JUST WANTED TO MAKE --

THE COURT: TWO JUST FOR DNA MATERIALS.

MR. COCHRAN: I WANTED TO MAKE SURE THE COURT WAS MINDFUL OF WHAT HE HAD SAID.

THE COURT: I DID. I HEARD VERY CAREFULLY. I LISTENED TO MR. PARK VERY CAREFULLY. THANK YOU, COUNSEL.

MR. DARDEN: THERE IS THE ISSUE OF THE OTHER BAG, RIGHT, THE SUEDE ONE.

THE COURT: THAT IS NOT BEING OFFERED IS MY UNDERSTANDING.

MR. DARDEN: SUEDE?

MR. COCHRAN: YOUR HONOR, MAY I MARK THIS 1066.

THE COURT: YES, FOR THE RECORD.

(DEFT'S 1066 FOR ID = BAG)

MR. DARDEN: THE SUEDE BAG IS NOT BEING OFFERED?

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY AND DEFENSE COUNSEL.)

MR. COCHRAN: HE COULDN'T IDENTIFY IT.

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. ARE YOU READY TO PROCEED?

MR. DARDEN: YES.

THE COURT: I DO STILL HAVE JUDGE WONG HERE AVAILABLE, BUT HE WOULD LIKE TO GET OUT OF HERE AS SOON AS POSSIBLE.

MS. CLARK: I'M SORRY, YOUR HONOR. I COULDN'T HEAR.

THE COURT: JUDGE WONG IS STILL HERE. HE WOULD LIKE TO LEAVE, THOUGH, BECAUSE HE HAS ANOTHER APPOINTMENT.

MR. DARDEN: IF WE COULD JUST DRAG OUT THE BAGS.

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. LET'S HAVE THE JURORS, PLEASE.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

(THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE HELD IN OPEN COURT, IN THE PRESENCE OF THE JURY:)

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU, LADIES AND GENTLEMEN. PLEASE BE SEATED. LET THE RECORD REFLECT THAT WE HAVE BEEN REJOINED BY ALL THE MEMBERS OF OUR JURY PANEL. MR. PARK, WOULD YOU RESUME THE WITNESS STAND, PLEASE.

ALLAN PARK, THE WITNESS ON THE STAND AT THE TIME OF THE NOON RECESS, RESUMED THE STAND AND TESTIFIED FURTHER AS FOLLOWS:

MS. CLARK: YOUR HONOR, IF I MAY, I HAD A COUPLE OF ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS ON REDIRECT, VERY, VERY BRIEFLY. I'M SORRY.

THE COURT: ALL RIGHT. GOOD AFTERNOON AGAIN, MR. PARK.

THE WITNESS: GOOD AFTERNOON, YOUR HONOR.

THE COURT: YOU ARE REMINDED YOU ARE STILL UNDER OATH, PLEASE. A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS, MISS CLARK.

MS. CLARK: THANK YOU, YOUR HONOR. I WILL BE BRIEF. GOOD AFTERNOON.

THE JURY: GOOD AFTERNOON

REDIRECT EXAMINATION (RESUMED)

BY MS. CLARK:

Q: MR. PARK, WHEN THE DEFENDANT WENT OVER TO THE SKYCAP, DID YOU -- WHAT DID YOU DO?

A: I PUT THE GOLF BAGS ON THE BIGGER LARGER SKYCAP CART AND THE DESIGNER BAG.

Q: OKAY. SO YOU ACTUALLY LIFTED THAT GOLF BAG, DID YOU?

A: YES.

Q: I'M GOING TO ASK YOU NOW TO LIFT THIS BAG FOR US AND TELL US IF THIS IS THE APPROXIMATE WEIGHT OF THE BAG THAT YOU PICKED UP AND PUT ON THE SKYCAP'S CARRIER?

A: IT IS CLOSE TO IT, YES.

Q: OKAY. AND NOW, THAT -- THIS BAG, SIR, GO AHEAD AND TAKE YOUR SEAT.

A: (WITNESS COMPLIES.

Q: THIS BAG, WHO TOOK IT OUT OF THE TRUNK OF THE CAR WHEN YOU GOT TO THE AIRPORT?

A: FROM WHAT I REMEMBER, MR. SIMPSON.

Q: AND WHO PUT IT -- TAKING IT FROM THE TRUNK, WHO PUT IT ONTO THE LUGGAGE CARRIER THAT YOU BROUGHT OUT OF THE AIRPORT?

A: I WAS HOLDING THE LUGGAGE CARRIER AND HE SET IT ON THE RACK.

Q: AND WHEN HE PICKED UP THAT BAG AND TOOK IT OUT OF THE TRUNK AND PUT IT ONTO THE LUGGAGE CARRIER, DID HE COMPLAIN TO YOU OF ANY PAIN IN HIS ARMS OR HIS SHOULDERS?

A: NO, HE DIDN'T.

Q: WHEN MR. SIMPSON WAS OVER BY THE SKYCAP, SIR, DID YOU SEE -- OTHER THAN THE GARMENT BAG AND THE GOLF BAG, DID YOU SEE WHERE THE OTHER BAGS WERE?

A: FROM WHAT I REMEMBER THERE WAS -- HE HAD THE ONE OVER HIS SHOULDER AND THERE WAS ANOTHER ONE SITTING ON TOP OF A TRASH CAN NEXT TO THE SKYCAP STAND.

Q: SO THERE WAS A BAG SITTING ON TOP OF THE TRASH CAN NEXT TO THE SKYCAP STAND?

A: YES.

Q: DID YOU SEE MR. SIMPSON DO ANYTHING WITH RESPECT TO THE BAG ON TOP OF THE TRASH CAN?

A: NO, I DIDN'T.

Q: AFTER YOU GOT MR. SIMPSON OVER TO THE SKYCAP AREA, AND THAT BAG WAS ON TOP OF THE TRASH CAN AND THE GARMENT BAG AND THE GOLF BAG WERE GIVEN TO THE SKYCAP, WHAT DID YOU DO?

A: UMM, I WALKED OVER TO HIM AND THAT IS WHEN I WAS GETTING READY TO LEAVE, AND SHOOK HIS HAND AND SAID "ADD TWENTY PERCENT" AND THAT WAS IT.

Q: SO YOU LEFT AT THAT POINT?

A: YES.

Q: DID YOU SEE MR. SIMPSON ENTER THE AIRPORT TERMINAL?

MR. COCHRAN: YOUR HONOR, THIS HAS BEEN ASKED AND ANSWERED BEFORE.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

THE WITNESS: UMM, NOT AT THAT POINT. WHEN I GOT BACK INTO THE CAR, AFTER I CHECKED THE CAR TO SEE IF HE LEFT ANYTHING, I DROVE AWAY, LOOKED DOWN THE TERMINAL AND HE WAS ON HIS WAY TO THE AIRPORT OR TO THE PLANE.

Q: BY MS. CLARK: DID YOU SEE WHAT HE WAS CARRYING?

A: NO.

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN THE DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS.)

MS. CLARK: OKAY. NOTHING FURTHER.

THE COURT: MR. COCHRAN.

RECROSS-EXAMINATION

BY MR. COCHRAN:

Q: SO AS I UNDERSTAND YOUR TESTIMONY, MR. PARK -- GOOD AFTERNOON, FIRST OF ALL.

THE WITNESS: GOOD AFTERNOON.

MR. COCHRAN: GOOD AFTERNOON, LADIES AND GENTLEMEN.

THE JURY: GOOD AFTERNOON.

Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: AS I UNDERSTAND YOUR TESTIMONY, THE LAST THING THAT YOU DID WITH MR. SIMPSON WAS YOU SHOOK HANDS WITH HIM AND THEN YOU TOOK YOUR LEAVE; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: CORRECT.

Q: AND YOU HAD HAD A RATHER PLEASANT ENCOUNTER WITH HIM; IS THAT A FAIR STATEMENT TO SAY, BASED UPON THE FACT YOU GOT HIM THERE ON TIME AND EVERYTHING WENT WELL?

A: YES.

Q: AND IN FACT HE SAID TO ADD TWENTY PERCENT TO THE BILL, RIGHT?

A: CORRECT.

Q: AND FIRST OF ALL, WITH REGARD TO THE GOLF BAG THAT WAS TAKEN OVER HERE, THIS WAS THE FIRST NIGHT THAT YOU HAD EVER SEEN MR. O.J. SIMPSON; ISN'T THAT CORRECT, IN YOUR LIFE, ON JUNE 12TH?

A: PERSONALLY, YES.

Q: YES, PERSONALLY, WHERE THE TWO OF YOU WERE TOGETHER?

A: YES.

Q: AND IN YOUR FIRST MEETING WITH MR. SIMPSON HE DIDN'T SHARE WITH YOU HIS LIFE SECRETS ABOUT HIM HAVING RHEUMATOID ARTHRITIS AND THINGS LIKE THAT, DID HE?

MS. CLARK: OBJECTION, YOUR HONOR. ASSUMES FACTS NOT IN EVIDENCE, CALLS FOR HEARSAY.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

THE WITNESS: NO.

Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: YOU ARE NOT SURPRISED BY THAT, ARE YOU, SIR?

A: NO, I'M NOT.

Q: YOU DIDN'T SHARE WITH HIM ANY MALADIES YOU HAD, EVEN AT YOUR YOUNG AGE, DID YOU?

A: NO, I DID NOT.

Q: YOU WERE JUST TRYING TO GET HIM TO THE AIRPORT ON TIME; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: NOW, SIR, WITH REGARD TO QUESTIONS YOU WERE ASKED, YOU WERE ASKED WHETHER OR NOT YOU WERE IN A HURRY AND YOU INDICATED TO MISS CLARK AT SOME POINT THAT YOU WERE IN FACT IN A HURRY AGAIN BECAUSE YOU WANTED TO GET MR. SIMPSON TO THE AIRPORT ON TIME; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: CORRECT.

Q: YOU PREVIOUSLY TOLD US ALREADY THAT AT SOME POINT YOU DROVE PERHAPS AS FAST AS 75 OR 80 SO COULD YOU ACCOMPLISH YOUR GOAL?

A: CORRECT.

Q: WHICH YOU DID, RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: YOU RECALL MISS CLARK ASKED YOU SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT YOU WERE LOOKING OR PAYING ATTENTION TO MR. SIMPSON'S BODY OR HIS HAND. DO YOU REMEMBER THOSE QUESTIONS?

A: YES.

Q: YOU WOULD HAVE REMEMBERED, WOULD YOU HAVE NOT, IF MR. SIMPSON HAD A BAND-AID, A LARGE BAND-AID ON THIS LEFT KNUCKLE HERE? IT WOULD STAND OUT? YOU WOULD REMEMBER THAT, WOULDN'T YOU?

A: IF I SAW IT, YES.

Q: YOU NEVER SAW THAT THAT NIGHT, DID YOU?

A: NO.

Q: ALL RIGHT. NOW, WITH REGARD TO THE TIME YOU WERE WAITING AND TRYING TO GET INSIDE THE ASHFORD GATE, WOULD I BE CORRECT IN ASSUMING THAT YOUR ATTENTION AT THAT TIME WAS -- YOU WERE CONCERNED ABOUT TRYING TO LOCATE SOMEBODY INSIDE THE PREMISES AND REACHING YOUR CLIENT; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: IN FACT, SO MUCH SO THAT YOU NOT ONLY CALLED YOUR BOSS, BUT YOU ALSO CALLED YOUR MOTHER; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: CORRECT.

Q: DURING THAT TIME FRAME? AND THAT PRETTY MUCH WAS YOUR FOCUS; ISN'T THAT RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: AND WHEN YOU TESTIFIED AT THE GRAND -- AT THE PRELIMINARY HEARING AS FOLLOWS, COUNSEL AGAIN AT PAGE 40 --

MS. CLARK: WAIT, WAIT, WAIT. PAGE 40?

MR. COCHRAN: YES, PAGE 40 BEGINNING AT LINE 17 -- LINE 15.

Q: WERE YOU ASKED THESE QUESTIONS AND GAVE THESE ANSWERS TO MISS CLARK? "WHAT GATE DID YOU LEAVE FROM? "ANSWER: THE ROCKINGHAM GATE. "QUESTION: AND WHICH WAY DID YOU GO ON ROCKINGHAM AS YOU EXITED THE GATE? "ANSWER: I MADE A LEFT. "QUESTION: DID YOU LOOK TO SEE WHETHER ANY CARS WERE PARKED ON THE RIGHT SIDE AS YOU FACED THE DRIVEWAY OF ROCKINGHAM OUTSIDE THE RESIDENCE?" YOUR ANSWER WAS: "I DIDN'T LOOK TO SEE.

"QUESTION: YOU WEREN'T LOOKING AT THE PARKED CARS?" AND YOUR ANSWER WAS: "YEAH." YOU WEREN'T LOOKING AT PARKED CARS THAT NIGHT BECAUSE YOUR FOCUS WAS ON SOMETHING ELSE; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: AS YOU TOLD US BEFORE, YOU CAN'T BE POSITIVE WHETHER OR NOT THERE WAS ANY PARKED CARS PARKED THERE TO THE RIGHT OF THE GATE WHEN YOU CAME OUT OF THAT GATE; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: AND WHEN YOU TESTIFIED AT THE GRAND JURY IN THAT CONNECTION, YOU WERE AGAIN TRYING TO BE AS ACCURATE AND AS FACTUAL AS YOU COULD, WERE YOU NOT?

A: YES, I WAS.

MR. COCHRAN: COUNSEL, LET'S BEGIN AT PAGE 270, ABOUT LINE 21. AND LET'S GO OVER TO PAGE 272, LINE 14. "QUESTION:" --

MS. CLARK: JUST ONE SECOND.

MR. COCHRAN: GRAND JURY.

(BRIEF PAUSE.)

(DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD BETWEEN DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY AND DEFENSE COUNSEL.)

Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: DO YOU RECALL BEING ASKED THESE SERIES OF QUESTIONS BY MISS CLARK ON JUNE 17, 1994? "QUESTION: WHEN YOU PULLED OUT OF THE DRIVEWAY OF THE SUSPECT'S HOUSE, WHAT DRIVEWAY EXIT DID YOU USE, ASHFORD OR ROCKINGHAM? "ANSWER: ROCKINGHAM. "QUESTION: WHEN YOU PULLED OUT OF THE ROCKINGHAM GATE WERE YOU ABLE TO SEE ANY CAR PARKED ON THE STREET NEXT TO THAT GATE? "ANSWER: THERE WAS A VEHICLE TO MY LEFT. WHEN I WAS EXITING I NOTICED I HAD TO LOOK AROUND A VEHICLE. I NEVER NOTICED WHAT KIND OF VEHICLE IT WAS. I DIDN'T PAY ANY ATTENTION TO THAT, BUT THERE WAS A VEHICLE THERE. "QUESTION: YOU SAY A VEHICLE TO YOUR LEFT. THAT WOULD BE THE AREA I AM INDICATING WITH MY PEN -- "ANSWER: CORRECT. "WHY DON'T YOU MARK THAT. "YOU SAID YOU NOTICED THE VEHICLE DOWN THERE? "ANSWER: YES. "(WITNESS COMPLIES.) "GO AHEAD AND HAVE A SEAT. "YOU EXITED OUT OF THE GATE THAT FEEDS ONTO ROCKINGHAM; IS THAT RIGHT? "ANSWER: YES. "SO YOU WERE ON THE LEFT SIDE OF YOUR CAR, RIGHT? "ANSWER: YES. "AND YOU ARE GOING TO MAKE A LEFT OUT OF THE GATE? "ANSWER: THAT'S CORRECT. "SO YOU ARE LOOKING TO YOUR LEFT FOR TRAFFIC, FOR ONCOMING TRAFFIC? "ANSWER: YEAH, BOTH WAYS. "QUESTION: DID YOU ATTEMPT TO LOOK VERY CAREFULLY TO SEE WHETHER THE CARS WERE PARKED ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE DRIVEWAY" I PRESUME THAT MEANS TO THE RIGHT SIDE. "ANSWER: THERE WERE NO CARS."

MS. CLARK: OBJECTION TO COUNSEL'S EDITORIALIZING. THAT IS NOT PART OF THE TRANSCRIPT.

THE COURT: JUST READ THE TRANSCRIPT, COUNSEL.

Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: "DID YOU ATTEMPT TO LOOK VERY CAREFULLY TO SEE WHETHER CARS WERE PARKED ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE DRIVEWAY? "ANSWER: THERE WERE NO CARS. "QUESTION: ARE YOU SURE? "ANSWER: I'M PRETTY SURE. "QUESTION: DID YOU MAKE AN EFFORT TO LOOK AND SEE IF THERE WERE ANY CARS THERE? "ANSWER: I LOOKED TO THE RIGHT TO SEE IF WERE ANY CARS COMING DOWN THE STREET. "I'M ASKING IF YOU LOOKED TO -- MADE AN EFFORT TO SEE IF THERE WAS A CAR PARKED? "ANSWER: NO." WAS THAT A CORRECT ANSWER AT THAT TIME?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. "QUESTION: THERE MIGHT HAVE BEEN A CAR PARKED THERE AND YOU DIDN'T SEE IT? "ANSWER: CORRECT." AND THE REASON WHY YOU DON'T KNOW ONE WAY OR THE OTHER IS BECAUSE YOU WEREN'T FOCUSING ON ANY CARS OR PAYING ANY ATTENTION; ISN'T THAT RIGHT?

MS. CLARK: OBJECTION. THAT MISSTATES THE TESTIMONY.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: BASICALLY YOUR GOAL WAS TO GET MR. O.J. SIMPSON -- TRY TO GET HIM TO THE AIRPORT ON TIME, ISN'T IT?

A: THAT'S CORRECT.

Q: THAT IS WHAT YOU ENDED UP DOING, ISN'T IT, SIR?

A: YES.

Q: NOW, HAVE YOU EVER HEARD THE ENGINE OF A FORD BRONCO?

A: WHAT YEAR?

Q: WELL, THAT IS A GOOD QUESTION. LET'S SEE. WELL, LET'S START WITH MY QUESTION FIRST. HAVE YOU EVER HEARD THE ENGINE OF ANY FORD BRONCO?

A: YES.

Q: AND WHAT YEAR WAS THE FORD BRONCO THAT YOU HEARD?

A: I'VE HEARD A LOT OF THEM.

Q: HAVE YOU?

A: YEAH.

Q: WELL --

A: WELL, OLDER CARS SEEM TO -- SOME OF THE OLDER BRONCOS SEEM TO BE A LITTLE BIT LOUDER THAN THE NEW ONES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. LET'S SEE. WHAT IS THE NEWEST FORD BRONCO THAT YOU HAVE HEARD?

A: I THINK IT WAS AN '88.

Q: '88? AND WHAT IS THE OLDEST?

A: UMM, HAD TO BE SOMEWHERE AROUND A '70, '72.

Q: PRETTY OLD ONE; IS THAT RIGHT?

A: YEAH.

Q: HOW LONG AGO WAS IT THAT YOU HEARD THE ENGINE OF THE '88 FORD BRONCO?

A: I DON'T REMEMBER THAT.

Q: SOMETIME IN YOUR PAST?

A: YES.

Q: ALL RIGHT. AND WOULD I BE CORRECT IN ASSUMING THAT THOSE ENGINES CAN BE LOUD ON OCCASION, THOSE CARS?

A: COULD BE.

Q: YOU DIDN'T HEAR THE ENGINES ON ANY CARS OR ANYTHING THAT SOUNDED LIKE A FORD BRONCO THAT NIGHT, DID YOU?

A: NO.

Q: NOW, MISS CLARK ASKED YOU SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT THIS FIGURE THAT WAS WALKING INTO THE WALKWAY THERE, OF THE ROCKINGHAM RESIDENCE; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: DO YOU REMEMBER THAT? AND YOU RECALL THAT, AS YOU HAVE TESTIFIED FOR US, THE FIGURE WAS WALKING TOWARDS THE DOOR WHEN YOU FIRST OBSERVED THAT FIGURE, RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: AND YOU SAW THAT FIGURE FOR ONLY A SECOND OR SO; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: AND YOU TOLD US THAT THAT FIGURE WAS ATTIRED IN SOMETHING DARK AND IT COULD HAVE BEEN A ROBE, YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT IT WAS; IS THAT CORRECT?

MS. CLARK: OBJECTION. THAT MISSTATES THE TESTIMONY.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: IT COULD HAVE BEEN A ROBE; IS THAT CORRECT?

A: JUST SEEMED TO BE DARK CLOTHING. IT COULD HAVE BEEN ANYTHING.

Q: IT COULD HAVE BEEN ANYTHING BECAUSE YOU DON'T KNOW; ISN'T THAT RIGHT?

A: THAT'S TRUE.

Q: YOU JUST GOT A FLEETING GLANCE; ISN'T THAT RIGHT, SIR?

A: YES.

Q: SO YOU NEVER HAD A CHANCE TO SEE THE HEM OF A ROBE SWIRLING AROUND OR ANYTHING OF THAT NATURE, DID YOU?

A: NO.

Q: AND WITH REGARD TO THIS TIME FRAME, YOU SHARED WITH US THAT IT WAS YOUR BELIEF THAT FROM THE TIME THAT YOU SAW THIS FIGURE TO THE TIME THAT YOU SAW MR. SIMPSON COME DOWN WITH A BAG, WHICH WE NOW KNOW IS THE LOUIS VITTON BAG, ONE OF THE DEFENDANT'S EXHIBITS, ABOUT FIVE OR SIX MINUTES, HAD PAST; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

MS. CLARK: OBJECTION. THAT MISSTATES THE TESTIMONY.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: AND THAT IS ABOUT FIVE OR SIX MINUTES; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: THAT IS YOUR BEST ESTIMATE; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

A: YES.

Q: YOU HAVE DONE THAT THROUGHOUT YOUR TESTIMONY HERE, GIVE US YOUR HONEST AND BEST ESTIMATE ISN'T THIS RIGHT, SIR?

A: YES.

Q: YOU HAVE DONE THAT WITH REGARD TO THAT FIVE OR SIX-MINUTE PERIOD OF TIME; ISN'T THAT RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: WHEN YOU WERE SHOWN PEOPLE'S 112 FOR IDENTIFICATION, THE FOYER AREA OF THE SIMPSON RESIDENCE THERE, DO YOU RECALL ON THAT NIGHT WHETHER OR NOT THERE WAS EVER A RUG ANYWHERE IN THAT FOYER AREA WHEN YOU WERE IN THERE, WHEN YOU WERE INSIDE THERE?

A: NO.

Q: YOU RECALL THAT YOU WALKED SOME TWO TO THREE FEET IN THERE YOURSELF BUT YOU DON'T REMEMBER SEEING A RUG OF ANY KIND; ISN'T THAT RIGHT?

A: NO.

Q: NOW, YOU NEVER WENT OUT AND LOOKED AND YOU WERE ASKED SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT LOOKING IN THE PLAY YARD FOR GOLF BALLS. YOU NEVER DID THAT, DID YOU?

A: NO, I DIDN'T.

Q: YOU WEREN'T THERE TO LOOK FOR GOLF BALLS?

MS. CLARK: OBJECTION. HE WAS NEVER ASKED TO GO OUT AND LOOK.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: YOU DIDN'T GO AROUND LOOKING IN MR. SIMPSON'S PREMISES FOR ANY GOLF BALLS, DID YOU?

A: NO.

Q: CAME THERE TO DO A JOB AND YOU TRIED TO DO THAT JOB; ISN'T THAT RIGHT, SIR?

A: THAT'S CORRECT.

MS. CLARK: OBJECTION, ASKED AND ANSWERED.

THE COURT: OVERRULED.

Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: YOU CAME THERE TO PICK HIM UP AND YOU LEFT AS SOON AS YOU COULD; IS THAT RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: YOU WERE ASKED SOME QUESTIONS ON REDIRECT EXAMINATION BY MISS CLARK REGARDING THE LOCATION OF THIS SMALLER BAG THAT WAS SOME TWENTY FEET AWAY FROM YOU. DO YOU RECALL THAT?

A: YES.

Q: AS YOU THINK BACK IN YOUR MIND'S EYE, CAN YOU TELL US HOW FAR THAT SECOND BAG WAS AWAY FROM THE SECOND CAR, IF THE SECOND CAR WAS THERE?

A: (NO AUDIBLE RESPONSE.)

MS. CLARK: OBJECTION. THAT IS CONFUSING, VAGUE.

THE COURT: DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE QUESTION, SIR?

THE WITNESS: YES.

Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: YOU MAY ANSWER.

A: IT -- IT SEEMED TO BE THREE TO FIVE FEET BEHIND THE BACK BUMPER.

Q: OF WHICH CAR?

A: OF THE SECOND CAR.

Q: IN OTHER WORDS, SO IF WE -- IF WE COULD PUT THAT DIAGRAM UP, IT WOULD BE BEHIND WHERE YOU BELIEVE THE SECOND -- THE BACK BUMPER OF THE SECOND CAR?

A: YES.

Q: NOT THE BENTLEY; IS THAT RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: AS I UNDERSTAND YOUR TESTIMONY, MR. KATO KAELIN HAD PLACED THE GOLF CLUBS IN THE BACK OF THE LIMOUSINE AT ROCKINGHAM; IS THAT RIGHT?

A: YES.

Q: AND WITH REGARD TO THESE GOLF CLUBS THAT HAVE NOW BEEN MARKED AS ONE OF OUR EXHIBITS -- 1063 FOR IDENTIFICATION?

THE COURT: YES.

MR. COCHRAN: MAY I APPROACH, YOUR HONOR?

THE COURT: YOU MAY.

Q: BY MR. COCHRAN: IT IS YOUR BELIEF THAT AS YOU LIFTED THE ITEMS THAT YOU LIFTED THAT NIGHT, APPEARED ABOUT THE SAME WEIGHT AS THAT?

THE COURT: IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS ABOUT TO GO OVER.

MR. COCHRAN: I WILL