Department no. 103 Hon. Lance A. Ito, Judge

APPEARANCES: (Appearances as heretofore noted.)

(Janet M. Moxham, CSR no. 4855, official reporter.)

(Christine M. Olson, CSR no. 2378, official reporter.)

(The following proceedings were held in open Court, out of the presence of the jury:)

THE COURT: Good morning, counsel. Back on the record in the Simpson matter. Mr. Simpson is again present before the Court with his counsel, Mr. Shapiro, Mr. Cochran, Mr. Bailey, Mr. Blasier, Mr. Neufeld. The People are represented by Mr. Goldman--Goldberg, excuse me, and Mr. Darden. The jury is not present. Counsel, anything we need to take up before we invite the jury to join us? All right. Let's have the jury, please.

(Brief pause.)

(The following proceedings were held in open Court, in the presence of the jury:)

MR. GOLDBERG: Your Honor, can we just approach for a moment off the record?

(A conference was held at the bench, not reported.)

(The following proceedings were held in open Court:)

THE COURT: All right. Thank you, ladies and gentlemen. Please be seated. Let the record reflect that we have been rejoined by all the members of our jury panel. Good morning, ladies and gentlemen.

THE JURY: Good morning.

THE COURT: All right. The People may call their next witness.

MR. GOLDBERG: Thank you. The People call Andrea Mazzola to the stand.

Andrea Mazzola, called as a witness by the People, was sworn and testified as follows:

THE CLERK: Please raise your right hand. You do solemnly swear that the testimony you may give in the cause now pending before this Court, shall be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help you God.

MS. MAZZOLA: I do.

THE CLERK: Please have a seat on the witness stand and state and spell your first and last names for the record.

MS. MAZZOLA: Andrea Mazzola, A-N-D-R-E-A M-A-Z-Z-O-L-A.

THE COURT: All right. Mr. Goldberg.

MR. GOLDBERG: Thank you.

DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. GOLDBERG

MR. GOLDBERG: Good morning, Miss Mazzola.

MS. MAZZOLA: Good morning.

MR. GOLDBERG: Good morning, ladies and gentlemen.

THE JURY: Good morning.

MR. GOLDBERG: Miss Mazzola directing your attention to the date of June 13, 1994, did you participate in some evidence collection at the location of 360 north Rockingham and 875 Bundy in Los Angeles?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, I did.

MR. GOLDBERG: And on the 14th did you also participate in some collection at the Bronco in the print shed?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, I did.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, before getting into those matters, I would like to ask you a little bit about your training and your experience. First of all, what is your job title?

MS. MAZZOLA: Criminalist 1.

MR. GOLDBERG: And a criminalist is?

MS. MAZZOLA: We work in the crime lab; collection, preservation of evidence and analyzing the evidence, testifying as an expert witness in Court.

MR. GOLDBERG: And is part of your job description as a criminalist, that you actually have to analyze evidence?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, it is.

MR. GOLDBERG: As part of analyzing evidence do you generate analyzed evidence reports?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, we do.

MR. GOLDBERG: And then as part of your job description are you also required to testify in Court as an expert witness?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, we are.

MR. GOLDBERG: Was that true when you were first hired with the Los Angeles Police Department as a criminalist 1?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, it was.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, before you became a criminalist 1 at the Los Angeles Police Department, did you have some formal training in school?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, I did.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what degree do you hold?

MS. MAZZOLA: I hold a bachelor of science in forensic science.

MR. GOLDBERG: And where is that from?

MS. MAZZOLA: California State University Sacramento.

MR. GOLDBERG: Before you were allowed to take courses that were specific to forensic science, did you have to take general background science courses?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what kind of courses did you take that were general background science courses before you got into the specifics of forensic science?

MS. MAZZOLA: We had to take general chemistry, organic chemistry, qualitative analysis, quantity--quantitative analysis, chemistry, biochemistry. We had to take some biology courses, such as anatomy, genetics, basic biology.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you take microbiology?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, I did.

MR. GOLDBERG: Organic chemistry?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. And after you were finished with taking these various general science courses, did you then take some courses that were specific to the area of criminalistics?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Approximately how many courses did you take in school that were specific to the area of criminalistics?

MS. MAZZOLA: It was approximately five.

MR. GOLDBERG: Was one of those courses a trace analysis course?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, it was.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what did that involve?

MS. MAZZOLA: It involved the analyzing of trace evidence, such as hair, fiber, minute glass particles, extremely small pieces of evidence.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you do any serology in that course?

MS. MAZZOLA: We did a basic ABO blood typing experiment.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And what is serology, if you could just give us a general definition?

MS. MAZZOLA: Serology deals with the analyzation of bodily fluids.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, did this professor that taught you in the trace analysis course use any particular technique to impress on you the importance of maintaining control of your evidence?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes. Umm, if he thought that we were not maintaining control over our evidence, if he thought we were leaving it out on the bench top, he would confiscate the evidence. And since the evidence was your unknown, you had to buy it back with points, and each report was only with 50 points to begin with, so if you lost 20 points buying your evidence, you more or less couldn't pass that one section.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you lose any points during this course as a result of not maintaining control of your evidence?

MS. MAZZOLA: No, no.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. And did this technique that the professor used seem to work in impressing on you the--

MS. MAZZOLA: It worked extremely well.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, as a student when you were there at the California State University did you start--did you participate with other students in starting any organizations in the area of criminalistics?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes. Umm, since forensic science was such a small major, we wanted to try to bring more people into the area, at least let them become familiar with it, so we started an organization which became recognized by the university to promote forensic science, to give people an idea of what it was.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Did you also begin attending meetings as a student of the California Association of Criminalists?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what is that association?

MS. MAZZOLA: It is an organization of criminalists, people in the fields. They attend meetings, seminars, classes, to gain more information in the field, to share ideas, new techniques.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And when you graduated from the California State University, did you begin working at a law enforcement agency--

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, I did.

MR. GOLDBERG: --as a criminalist? What agency was that?

MS. MAZZOLA: It was the Kern County District Attorney's office crime lab in Bakersfield.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what was your job title there when you began with the Kern County District Attorney's office in their crime lab?

MS. MAZZOLA: I was a criminalist.

MR. GOLDBERG: What were you doing in the crime lab?

MS. MAZZOLA: I was assigned to the toxicology unit.

MR. GOLDBERG: And toxicology is what?

MS. MAZZOLA: It is the analysis of blood and urine for drugs of abuse.

MR. GOLDBERG: So you are dealing with biological specimens in toxicology?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, how long were you at the Kern County District Attorney's office crime lab?

MS. MAZZOLA: It was approximately 18 months.

MR. GOLDBERG: And when you were there working in toxicology, umm, was there anything that you learned in terms of handling biological specimens and avoiding cross-contamination that would be relevant towards processing a crime scene?

MS. MAZZOLA: Well, anytime you are working with biologicals or any evidence, you have to be careful of cross-contamination. You only work on one item or one sample at a time. You never have two items open at the same time. You are very careful about the utensils you use, whether it is pipettes, which are usually disposable, or tweezers or scissors, anything.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And when you were there at the Kern County District Attorney's office crime lab, did you have the opportunity to see what other criminalists were doing in areas that were not involved with toxicology?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: So did you sort of get an overview of different areas of criminalistics while you were there?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, I did.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you ever have the opportunity of seeing people at the Kern County crime lab, the criminalists, processing bloody clothing or clothing from rape cases that might contain biological evidence?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, I did.

MR. GOLDBERG: While you were there did you join any other organizations that are involved in the area of criminalistics?

MS. MAZZOLA: Well, I joined the American Academy of Forensic Science.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what is the American Academy of Forensic Sciences as opposed to the California Association of Criminalists?

MS. MAZZOLA: They are similar in that they are both organizations dealing with the area of criminalistics, forensic science, the law. The American academy takes a wider view. We have people who are in the law, we have dentists. There are different sections dealing with the different professions.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Did you also join the California Association of Criminalists?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, I joined as a member.

MR. GOLDBERG: Was that in this same time frame?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, it was.

MR. GOLDBERG: And you were there for you said 18 months?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, after you left the Kern County District Attorney's office crime lab, where did you go?

MS. MAZZOLA: I started looking for another job.

MR. GOLDBERG: And did you find employment as a criminalist?

MS. MAZZOLA: I found employment as a toxicologist in a private lab.

MR. GOLDBERG: What was that lab?

MS. MAZZOLA: Valley toxicology.

MR. GOLDBERG: So as a toxicologist were you doing the same thing that you were doing when you were working in the Kern County toxicology section?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And you were doing the actual--is it a chemical analysis or a physical analysis of the biological specimens?

MS. MAZZOLA: It is more of a chemical analysis.

MR. GOLDBERG: Are you testing for anything other than drugs?

MS. MAZZOLA: No, just drugs.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. When were you--at this toxicology, valley toxicology, what were the dates that you were there?

MS. MAZZOLA: Oh, let's see. Let me check my--it was approximately May of `93 to about the middle of December of `93.

MR. GOLDBERG: And after you left valley toxicology where did you go?

MS. MAZZOLA: I was offered a position with LAPD.

MR. GOLDBERG: When did you start with LAPD?

MS. MAZZOLA: January 24, 1994.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And when you were hired were you hired alone or were there other people that were hired in the same group?

MS. MAZZOLA: There were three other people who were hired approximately the same time as I was.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, in approximately April of 1994 did you go through a mini academy?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what did that involve?

MS. MAZZOLA: It involved showing us the way that the LAPD crime lab collects their evidence, the different sections, what they had to offer us, what they had available to help us at a crime scene or analyzing evidence once we got back to the lab.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did they teach you how to physically pick up evidence and collect evidence at a crime scene?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did they teach you how to collect bodily fluids?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, they did.

MR. GOLDBERG: How was that done? Was that a theoretical instruction or a practical or a combination?

MS. MAZZOLA: It was a combination. They first told us why they do it this way, why you need to pick up, be it blood or whatever. Then we had practical hands-on where we would actually pick up the blood from different substrates; concrete, carpet, stone.

MR. GOLDBERG: So were these mock crime scenes or what were they when you were picking up this blood in the mini academy?

MS. MAZZOLA: It really wasn't like a mock crime scene. They just had the blood on the different substrates that we would tend to run into out in the real world, so we would have hands-on experience on how to manipulate the stain, how to collect it, preserve it, to learn, you know, to be careful about contamination.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did they also teach you other techniques such as tool marks, dust prints, shoeprints and the like?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. Now, how difficult was it for you to learn how to pick up blood, biological evidence?

MS. MAZZOLA: It is not hard at all.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And as a criminalist, when you start as a criminalist 1, are you expected to go out to crime scenes and pick up evidence?

MS. MAZZOLA: We are expected to accompany the more experienced criminalists when we can. We watch them, the way they process scenes. We are allowed to pick up evidence under their supervision. It gives us more training under supervision.

MR. GOLDBERG: How long are you a criminalist 1 before you can become a criminalist 2?

MS. MAZZOLA: We are a criminalist 1 for a year and a half.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, is there some aspect in which even though you are a criminalist 1 and you've been taught how to do these physical--how to physically collect the evidence, is there some aspect in which you are still being trained in crime scene investigation during that 18 months?

MS. MAZZOLA: In that period it is more like we are being trained in the discretionary area to go to a crime scene, to look at it, to decide what is evidence, what we can pick up that would be of value, what can be analyzed back at the lab. That is the part that we are being trained in as criminalist 1's.

MR. GOLDBERG: Well, are you still being trained in the physical part of how you actually physically pick up a shoeprint or how you physically pick up a piece of biological evidence?

MS. MAZZOLA: To a certain extent. For the most part we are trained in the technical area. It is the discretionary area, making the decisions, that we are in the process of learning.

MR. GOLDBERG: What all does this discretionary area involve in terms of being a criminalist? Is it just what to pick up and what not to pick up?

MS. MAZZOLA: Well, also it involves dealing with the people you will find at the scene; the detectives, the Coroner's people, determining what is viable evidence versus what is really not part of the scene.

MR. GOLDBERG: When you are at a scene do you simply just pick up anything and everything that happens to be in the area or within a certain diameter of the bodies, in the case of a murder? How do you go about making that kind of a decision?

MS. MAZZOLA: That again is the discretionary area. You have to look at the whole scene, try to get an idea of what could have happened and start looking for items that could be connected. It is better to pick up a little more than not enough.

MR. GOLDBERG: Is there any problem with just indiscriminately collecting everything that you see?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, because you will spend all your time picking up every single little bit of paper or whatever and you are not adding towards figuring out what happened. You are adding a lot of garbage is what it is.

MR. GOLDBERG: And is it this area in which during the 18 months you are still being trained then in terms of how to evaluate a crime scene, how to make this kind of decision?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, that's the area.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, prior to the work that you did on June the 13th, had you actually gone out on crime scenes and seen other people collect evidence and collect some evidence yourself?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, I did.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, when you listed the number of crime scenes, do you distinguish between a crime scene and a car search?

MS. MAZZOLA: I did. Some people don't, but at that point I did.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. So some people put the two of them together?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. With respect to your first crime scene, did you actually pick up any evidence at that crime scene?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, under supervision.

MR. GOLDBERG: And was there any biological evidence that was involved in that first crime scene?

MS. MAZZOLA: There was a lot of biological evidence.

MR. GOLDBERG: Can you give us just a guesstimate as to how many stains?

MS. MAZZOLA: (no audible response.)

MR. GOLDBERG: I mean, are we talking about less than a dozen or more than a dozen?

MS. MAZZOLA: More than a dozen.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you pick up some of those stains yourself?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, I did.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, when you processed that first crime scene, did you get any feedbacks in terms of how you had done?

MS. MAZZOLA: We--the people that were processing the scene were given a commendation for the scene.

MR. GOLDBERG: So this was your first crime scene and you received a commendation for it?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: And was that presented in some awards ceremony?

MS. MAZZOLA: They mentioned it at our annual luncheon, they read the commendation.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Did you also process another crime scene after this and before June the 13th that had biological evidence in it?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And did that have multiple stains as well?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, it did.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you pick up those stains?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, I did.

MR. GOLDBERG: Were there any other crime scenes that you participated in before June the 13th that had biological evidence that you physically participated in collecting?

MS. MAZZOLA: There was one that had biological evidence, but the collection procedure was not the procedures used on the other scenes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, was that a car search or--

MS. MAZZOLA: Right. This was a car search.

MR. GOLDBERG: And you said that you do make a distinction between those?

MS. MAZZOLA: I do.

MR. GOLDBERG: But there was one car search that you were involved in that also had biological evidence?

MS. MAZZOLA: Correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, after June the 13th and before today's date did you participate in any more crime scenes that had biological evidence that needed to be collected?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And can you give us an approximate number?

MS. MAZZOLA: Of scenes?

MR. GOLDBERG: Yeah.

MS. MAZZOLA: (no audible response.)

MR. GOLDBERG: And include car searches.

MS. MAZZOLA: Oh, okay. Biological, there were two actual scenes.

MR. NEUFELD: I'm sorry?

THE COURT: Scenes.

MR. NEUFELD: Scenes.

MR. NEUFELD: Okay.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, at the crime lab, the Los Angeles Police Department crime lab, do they have a position that is known as criminalist trainee?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Is that any kind of an official word that is used?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: A trainee?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. But as you said, there is--to some extent you are being trained in crime scene processing and investigation--

MS. MAZZOLA: Correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: --as a criminalist 1? At the crime scenes that--the crime scenes that you participated in on June the 13th and also on the 14th in the Bronco, if we divide the work of a criminalist up the way that you have suggested into the mental and discretionary type components and the physical collection components--

MR. NEUFELD: Objection. I don't believe she ever used the word "Mental."

THE COURT: Overruled.

MR. GOLDBERG: Which--who was responsible for the mental or the discretionary type components?

MS. MAZZOLA: That is the criminalist 3's area.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, going back a second to this mini academy, when you were going through the mini academy, do they actually teach you specifically what the people in serology are going to do with the evidence after you've collected it, in the case of biological evidence?

MS. MAZZOLA: Not specifically, no.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And do they train you actually how to do DNA tests?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: So are they training you the physical collection procedures?

MS. MAZZOLA: That's correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, I would like to direct your attention back to the date of June the 13th, 1994. At some point in the early morning did you receive a telephone call that awakened you?

MS. MAZZOLA: I was already awake.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay.

MS. MAZZOLA: But I did get the call.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what time was that?

MS. MAZZOLA: It was approximately 5:25 in the morning.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. And did that call notify you that you were to respond to a crime scene?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, are all criminalists at the laboratory expected to respond to crime scenes?

MS. MAZZOLA: We are all put on a rotation.

MR. GOLDBERG: And how often are you on this rotation, approximately?

MS. MAZZOLA: Approximately three months, every three months we come up.

MR. GOLDBERG: And for what length of a period of time are you on call every three months?

MS. MAZZOLA: Sometimes we are on call for a week. We take the evening calls at night. Sometimes we are assigned to the weekend and it is 24 hours a day.

MR. GOLDBERG: So on this particular occasion on June 13th did this simply happen to be the occasion that you were on call?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, it was.

MR. GOLDBERG: What did you have to do after you got this call notifying you that you needed to respond to a crime scene?

MS. MAZZOLA: I called my criminalist 3, Mr. Fung, and informed him that we had a scene and we were to meet at the laboratory.

MR. GOLDBERG: And was he also on call?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: For what purpose did you need to meet at the laboratory?

MS. MAZZOLA: We needed to meet there to pick up the crime scene truck.

MR. GOLDBERG: And did you do so?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And did the--did you then drive in the truck to the location--to the Rockingham location?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, while you were going to the Rockingham location in the truck, was there any conversation with respect to filling out the crime scene identification checklist, the Officer in Charge portion?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Your Honor, at this time I would like to take a look at People's 161 identification.

(Brief pause.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Miss Mazzola, is the resolution on your screen good enough so that you can--

MS. MAZZOLA: Not really.

MR. GOLDBERG: Maybe we can just focus in on the area that says "OIC name." Okay. You need to pull the paper a little bit over to the right.

(Brief pause.)

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. Now, can you recognize this?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: And did you--is this your handwriting?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, it is.

MR. GOLDBERG: And your name is where it says "Officer in Charge"?

MS. MAZZOLA: Correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: What was the conversation that you had with respect to filling out that portion of this form?

MR. NEUFELD: Objection as to the hearsay remarks of anyone else in the trial.

THE COURT: Sustained.

MR. GOLDBERG: As to what?

THE COURT: Sustained.

THE COURT: Hearsay as to what the discussion was.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Well, it is not coming in for the truth of the matter, your Honor.

THE COURT: Overruled. Excuse me. Sustained. Still sustained.

MR. GOLDBERG: But at any rate, your name was put in that location?

MS. MAZZOLA: Correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: Without telling us what the conversation was, there was some conversation about it?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, after you actually got to the location, did you continue to be the--or were you the Officer in Charge after you got to the Rockingham location?

MS. MAZZOLA: Once we found out what was all involved, I was not the Officer in Charge.

MR. GOLDBERG: Who became the Officer in Charge?

MS. MAZZOLA: Mr. Fung.

MR. GOLDBERG: What are the functions of the Officer in Charge, as opposed to the person assisting him or her?

MS. MAZZOLA: The Officer in Charge, no. 1, talked to the detectives to try to get an idea of what is going on, they make the discretionary calls as to what to pick up as evidence, they interact with the people at the scene, whether it is the detectives, police officers, Coroner's officials.

MR. GOLDBERG: Who directs the other SID people, like print people and photography people?

MS. MAZZOLA: That is the Officer in Charge.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, did you perform those functions at the Rockingham or Bundy locations?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: I would next like to take a look at People's 189--

(Discussion held off the record between the Deputy District Attorneys.)

MR. GOLDBERG: --for identification.

(Brief pause.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, with respect to People's 189 for identification, when was this document filled out?

MS. MAZZOLA: Part of it--

MR. NEUFELD: I'm sorry. Objection, your Honor. Foundation. We don't even know who filled it out first.

THE COURT: Sustained. Rephrase the question.

MR. GOLDBERG: Is this your handwriting?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, it is.

MR. GOLDBERG: When was this filled out?

MS. MAZZOLA: Part of it was filled out the morning of the 13th.

MR. GOLDBERG: Was that shortly after you arrived at Rockingham?

MR. NEUFELD: Objection, leading.

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: When was that?

MS. MAZZOLA: Shortly after we arrived at the Rockingham location.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And you placed--and did you have any conversation with respect to how this form was going to be filled out that you can remember?

MS. MAZZOLA: No, not really.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Was this a matter of consequence in your mind?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

THE COURT: All right. For the record, People's 189 is the vehicle search checklist.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now--thank you. That is fine. By the way, did you do any searching of the interior of the Bronco at any time on the 13th or was that done at some later time?

MS. MAZZOLA: That was done at a later time.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. Now, shortly after you arrived at the Rockingham location did you have any conversations with any detectives who gave you a walk-through of the location?

MS. MAZZOLA: I personally did not talk to any of the detectives.

MR. GOLDBERG: Were you present when that happened?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And without telling us what was said, what happened?

MS. MAZZOLA: They showed us some things that they were interested in, they wanted us to take a look at.

MR. GOLDBERG: Was that a general walk-through?

MS. MAZZOLA: At first it was the Bronco and after there were some other items they wanted us to take a look at.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you recall who the detective was that did that, or detectives?

MS. MAZZOLA: I personally don't.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, did you physically collect some of the stains that were located at the Rockingham location that morning, the morning of the 13th?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And did Mr. Fung participate physically in the collection of some of those stains?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, he did.

MR. GOLDBERG: Your Honor, at this time I would like to take a look at the demonstration board. It is People's 162 for identification.

THE COURT: Yes.

(Brief pause.)

MR. GOLDBERG: I don't know whether you can see this, Miss Mazzola.

MS. MAZZOLA: I have an idea what is on it.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay.

MR. GOLDBERG: Using this demonstration board, can you describe for us, starting with the first cell on People's 162, the steps that are involved in collecting a stain?

MS. MAZZOLA: May I--

MR. GOLDBERG: Maybe we can see that--can we see that cell?

THE COURT: All right. Miss Mazzola, can you see it on your monitor here?

MS. MAZZOLA: Oh, okay.

THE COURT: Sorry?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes. That shows two spots, blood spots, that are numbered.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. And is the first phase in this collection stated on the board the numbering and measuring phase?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, it is.

MR. GOLDBERG: And is there a documentation aspect to that phase as well?

MS. MAZZOLA: The location, measurements, the photo i.d. Numbers and a brief description are noted on the evidence collection sheet.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. And are the items also photographed before they are collected?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, they are.

MR. GOLDBERG: So all of that occurs prior to the physical collection?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, directing your attention to cell no. 2 that says "Dampened swatch," what is involved in this stage of the collection procedure?

MS. MAZZOLA: A small cloth swatch of the approximate size you need is selected with a pair of clean tweezers. A drop of distilled water is put on the swatch. It is then shaken so any excess water is shaken off.

MR. GOLDBERG: And directing your attention now to cell no. 3 that says "Collect substrate control," what is done in this phase of the correction procedure?

MS. MAZZOLA: The cloth swatch is placed on the substrate, the concrete or whatever, as close to the stain as possible, but without getting it in the stain, to get a background control of what the sample is on.

MR. GOLDBERG: What does the term "Substrate" mean?

MS. MAZZOLA: That is just the substance that the item of interest is on.

MR. GOLDBERG: So if the item of interest, for example, instead of being on a walkway, were on a wall, what would be the substrate?

MS. MAZZOLA: The wall would be the substrate.

MR. GOLDBERG: Or if it were on clothing, what would be the substrate?

MS. MAZZOLA: The clothing.

MR. GOLDBERG: What is the purpose of taking this control that is near the stain but not on the stain?

MS. MAZZOLA: Well, it could be used for two factors: One is to provide a background, what the sample was on, so when they go to run tests on the sample, they can see if the background itself would interfere with the tests. The control can also be checked for DNA or other items of interest to see if any contamination took place.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, so this control is basically just a blank swatch that has water on it that is put on the concrete in this example?

MS. MAZZOLA: Correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: So do you handle this piece of evidence exactly--or this piece of swatch exactly the same way that you would handle a swatch that was actually put on the stain?

MS. MAZZOLA: It is handled the same way.

MR. GOLDBERG: Why is it that you use the identical handling procedures for the substrate control that you would use for a swatch that was actually put on the stain?

MS. MAZZOLA: Because you want them to be as identical as possible. The only difference being one will contain the item of interest; the other won't.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, directing your attention to cell no. 4 on People's 1--excuse me--162 for identification, what phase of the collection procedure is shown here?

MS. MAZZOLA: It looks like the cloth swatch is being placed into a small plastic envelope, small plastic bag. The control is placed in one bag.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And now directing your attention to cell no. 5 that says "Clean tweezers"--excuse me. I'm sorry. Now, directing your attention to cell no. 5, that says "Clean tweezers" in our demonstration?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes. After the control is taken, the tweezers are cleaned with distilled water and a chem wipe, which is like a laboratory Kleenex.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, directing your attention to cell no. 6, which says on our board "Take new swatch, then dampen it," what does this phase of the collection procedure involve?

MS. MAZZOLA: Our swatches are stored in plastic tubes so you have to take a small selection of them out of the tube without handling them and then you can select the correct size that you need, so that is what is being shown.

MR. GOLDBERG: How do you decide which size to take?

MS. MAZZOLA: It depends on the size of the stain. You want to select a size swatch that is small enough that--so when you apply it to the stain you would get it as concentrated as possible.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, in this particular photograph it is kind of hard for me to see that there are actually swatches in that little bottle, but is that what you are saying?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: The swatches come from that bottle?

MS. MAZZOLA: That's right.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, let's take a look at cell no. 7 that says "Collect stain" and "Number card removed" is in parentheses. What are you doing here?

MS. MAZZOLA: That would be the actual collection of the stain.

MR. GOLDBERG: And did you have to dampen the swatch before you--

MS. MAZZOLA: Right, the same as with the control. You dampen the swatch, shake off the excess water, then you apply the swatch to the stain.

MR. GOLDBERG: And finally taking a look at cell no. 8 that says, "Package stain in same envelope with substrate control," what is involved in this procedure?

MS. MAZZOLA: The swatch with the stain is placed in a separate plastic envelope. Both the control and the swatch with the item you are interested in are placed in the same coin envelope with the item number written on the outside.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now when you are--thank you.

(Brief pause.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, when you are collecting one of these stains, do you collect one stain at a time?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And I want to ask you some questions about different things that could happen when you are collecting a stain. Do you--do you ever drop the tweezers while you are doing that?

MS. MAZZOLA: That can happen.

MR. GOLDBERG: What happens if you do that?

MS. MAZZOLA: You clean them all over again.

MR. GOLDBERG: When you are taking a swatch that actually has blood on it, do you ever drop that bloody swatch?

MS. MAZZOLA: That has never happened to me.

MR. GOLDBERG: When you are pouring the--maybe pouring is not the right word, but you are taking some of those little swatches out of the container, the little pill bottle--

MS. MAZZOLA: Uh-huh.

MR. GOLDBERG: --do those swatches ever fall?

MS. MAZZOLA: They do occasionally, yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: What do you do with those swatches?

MS. MAZZOLA: I don't use them.

MR. GOLDBERG: Could you use them as substrate controls?

MS. MAZZOLA: You could.

MR. GOLDBERG: But you do not do that?

MS. MAZZOLA: But I personally don't do that.

MR. GOLDBERG: So you just throw them away?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: When you are picking up a swatch, do any of the swatches ever stick together?

MS. MAZZOLA: That happens sometimes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. What do you do in that kind of instance?

MS. MAZZOLA: If you are taking either the control or the actual item, you can use both swatches.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. But what if you have two swatches stuck together? Do you try to separate them or is it possible that you could apply both of them to the stain at the same time, without knowing it?

MS. MAZZOLA: You can tell if two of them are stuck together. Umm, you separate them and you--you use one swatch at a time, either to pick up the control or to pick up the stain itself.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And what about the labeling of the coin envelopes? Have you ever mislabeled one of those by writing the wrong item number?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. When are they--when are the envelopes labeled in relationship to when the collection takes place? Before--

MS. MAZZOLA: The envelopes were labeled before.

MR. GOLDBERG: So do you put the--if you are collecting stain no. 5, for example--

MS. MAZZOLA: Uh-huh.

MR. GOLDBERG: --in our demonstration, you are going to put that in an envelope that is labeled what?

MS. MAZZOLA: No. 5.

MR. GOLDBERG: And that would be done before you moved on to no. 6?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, when you were at the Rockingham location did you place your initials on all the coin envelopes as you were collecting them?

MS. MAZZOLA: At the time I thought I did. Looking back I apparently didn't.

MR. GOLDBERG: And do you recall testifying at what we've been referring to or sometimes referred to as a griffin hearing on August 23, I believe, of 1994?

MS. MAZZOLA: I remember testifying at the griffin hearing.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And in that--when you were testifying at that hearing at that time, did you believe that you had put all of your initials or your initials on all of the items that you had collected on the 13th?

MS. MAZZOLA: At that time I believe I had.

MR. GOLDBERG: And did you since learn that you did not?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. NEUFELD: Objection. What she assumes is hearsay.

THE COURT: Sustained. Rephrase the question.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Did you since look at photographs of some of the items collected?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And have you learned that you did not?

MS. MAZZOLA: I learned I had not.

MR. GOLDBERG: On the other scenes that you had processed--

MR. NEUFELD: Your Honor, I'm sorry. Move to strike the last answer. It is conclusionary as opposed to testimony.

THE COURT: Overruled. Overruled.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, on the other stains--excuse me--other scenes that you had collected stains on prior to the 13th, had you initialed on those occasions?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And why wasn't that done here at the scene?

MS. MAZZOLA: I was told that there were only two of us that--

MR. NEUFELD: Objection as to what she was told.

THE COURT: Sustained.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Without telling us what was said, was there a conversation about this?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And after the conversation did--was there some conclusion that was arrived at?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what was the conclusion?

MR. NEUFELD: Objection, your Honor.

THE COURT: What is the basis?

MR. NEUFELD: Hearsay again.

THE COURT: Overruled.

MS. MAZZOLA: There were only going to be two of us at the scenes collecting evidence. We were working as a team, so it really didn't matter if our initials were on the envelopes since we were working as a team.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, as to the crime scene identification checklist that we talked a little bit about, when you testified at the griffin hearing, what was your understanding of how that checklist was supposed to be used?

MS. MAZZOLA: At the time I thought that everything had to be filled out. The other scenes that I had gone on they had filled out the checklist.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Maybe we can see a portion. I think it is 1107.

(Discussion held off the record between the Deputy District Attorneys.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Let's just take a look at the last page of the exhibit. It is 1107 for identification.

THE COURT: All right. Mr. Fairtlough, what page number is that? They are numbered at the top.

MR. FAIRTLOUGH: Page 2 of 2.

MR. GOLDBERG: I don't think it has a number. It is the one that has 17, 18 and 19.

THE COURT: All right.

MR. GOLDBERG: Or 18, 17 and 19.

(Brief pause.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Is this the form that you use out in the field when you are collecting evidence?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: It is a little blurry there.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, prior to testifying at the griffin hearing did you believe that every single box in every single column needed to be filled out?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And as a result of your training and experience after the griffin hearing, did you learn something different?

MS. MAZZOLA: I learned that this is a general guideline for us. Some of the boxes really don't apply to us at the scene.

MR. GOLDBERG: When did you start--when did you learn that?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right after I testified at the griffin hearing.

MR. GOLDBERG: And got back to the laboratory?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. With respect to the time column, have you noticed now, based upon the experience that you have to date, that different criminalists in the Los Angeles Police Department have different practices with respect to how they fill out that column?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And how is that used?

MS. MAZZOLA: Some fill out every single individual time that something is collected. Others put a starting time that they start collecting evidence and an ending time when they stop. Everything that is collected is collected while you are at the scene, so it happens between those two times.

MR. GOLDBERG: And then are there some people that use what I guess you might call an intermediate type usage of that time column and put in some times, as you did on the 13th?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. NEUFELD: Objection, leading.

THE COURT: Sustained. The answer is stricken. Rephrase the question.

MR. GOLDBERG: Are there some people that use an intermediate technique?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. Now, getting back to the collection of the evidence at Rockingham, perhaps we can take a look at People's 120 for identification. It is the board of Rockingham, the outside stains.

(Brief pause.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, with respect to People's 120 for identification, do you recognize what is depicted here?

MS. MAZZOLA: That is not showing up.

MR. GOLDBERG: It is not going to be on the monitor. Maybe you can just step down for a moment and take a look at this.

MS. MAZZOLA: Okay. Yes, I recognize it.

MR. GOLDBERG: And are these photographs that depict various items that you participated in collecting on the 13th at Rockingham?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. NEUFELD: Yes.

THE COURT: Overruled. May we have a side bar, your Honor?

THE COURT: Overruled.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, when you were doing the physical collection on these, do you recall what order they were done in? Were they done in numerical order?

MS. MAZZOLA: For the most part, yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And would that mean that you started with the stains that are down towards the gate?

MS. MAZZOLA: The first stain that was collected was on--excuse me--on the door of the Bronco.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you know who physically collected that?

MS. MAZZOLA: I don't know who physically collected that.

MR. NEUFELD: I'm sorry, I couldn't hear.

MS. MAZZOLA: Excuse me. I was the one who collected the one on the Bronco.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, with respect to the stains that are leading from the Bronco into the driveway area, did you and Dennis Fung physically collect those--

MR. NEUFELD: Objection as to her and Dennis Fung.

THE COURT: Overruled.

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, can you tell us, when you first started the collection, can you be more specific as to who was doing what in terms of the physical collection?

MS. MAZZOLA: As I said, I was the one that collected the stain offer the Bronco, and Mr. Fung collected the stain on the street. When we got to the driveway, he did, I believe it was like the first two stains, and I took over from there and was the one who physically collected the rest.

MR. GOLDBERG: With respect to the other stains, do you have a recollection of whether he physically participated in collecting any of those?

MS. MAZZOLA: He was present for some.

MR. GOLDBERG: So at the beginning of the stains he was doing more of the physical collection and then towards the end less?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: And with respect to the first phase of the collection procedure, the documentation, the numbering and the measuring phase, how did the two of you work together to accomplish that?

MS. MAZZOLA: We worked as a team.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. Now, with respect to the stains at the end of the outdoor area, stain no. 7 and stain no. 8, do you recall where Dennis Fung was around the time that those were collected?

MS. MAZZOLA: At first he was not present, but as I kept working, he came up.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you recall whether anyone else was present at the time those stains were collected?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: In the immediate area?

MS. MAZZOLA: There was someone in the immediate area.

MR. GOLDBERG: Who was that?

MS. MAZZOLA: Mr. Steve Johnson.

MR. GOLDBERG: Who is he?

MS. MAZZOLA: He is the assistant lab director.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you know where Dennis Fung was at the time that he was not present?

MS. MAZZOLA: No, I don't.

MR. GOLDBERG: Where he went?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: But he went somewhere and at some point came back?

MS. MAZZOLA: Correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, with respect to the stains at the Rockingham location, were--was every single last stain collected or were there some that were not collected?

MS. MAZZOLA: There were some that were not collected.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what is your training with respect to the need to collect every stain as opposed to less than all the stains?

MS. MAZZOLA: Well, on a trail you want to get a representative sample, you want to get the first few stains, you want to pick up the last few stains. The ones in between, as long as they appear to be going in the general direction, there is nothing out of the ordinary with them, not every single stain has to be collected.

MR. GOLDBERG: And is that the technique that you and Mr. Fung used with respect to collecting these stains?

MS. MAZZOLA: That's correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right--you can--I want to ask you some questions that you may have to refer to your crime scene identification checklist for, so you may want to return to the stand.

MS. MAZZOLA: (Witness complies.)

THE COURT: Mr. Goldberg, are you going to refer back to this exhibit, People's 120, for a minute.

MR. GOLDBERG: I want to talk about stains, unless logistically we can't do that.

THE COURT: Well, if you are going to be referring to it, proceed.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. With respect to the stains numbered 4 through 6 on our diagram, with the photo i.d. Numbers, 4 through 6, down towards the beginning portion of the driveway, can you tell us the time frame that those stains were collected?

MR. NEUFELD: I'm sorry, your Honor. The record should reflect that the witness is refreshing her recollection from some notes. May I approach the witness and see?

THE COURT: You may.

MR. NEUFELD: Thank you.

THE COURT: Miss Mazzola, what are you referring to?

MS. MAZZOLA: I'm referring to the crime scene notes.

THE COURT: All right. Thank you. Proceed.

MS. MAZZOLA: They were collected around nine o'clock, all within a few minutes of each other.

MR. GOLDBERG: And with respect to the stains that are up towards the--close to the entrance area, stain no. 7, stain no. 8, what was the time frame of those stains?

MS. MAZZOLA: Those were approximately ten to fifteen minutes later.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you have some time frames in your crime scene identification checklist to give us?

MS. MAZZOLA: Item 7 was collected approximately 9:10. Item 8, approximately fifteen minutes later.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, when you were at the location, from what you saw of all of the stains, did any of them appear to have been stepped in?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, before--I can take this down now, your Honor.

THE COURT: All right.

(Brief pause.)

THE COURT: Mr. Fairtlough, why don't you swing that around.

(Brief pause.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Before you left the Rockingham location, did you and Mr. Fung do any--go through any process in terms of double-checking the evidence that you had?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: What was that?

MS. MAZZOLA: We knew what item numbers we collected. We look at each individual item to make sure that we had everything.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And is that a routine thing that you have done on the other crime scenes that you were on before this?

MS. MAZZOLA: At the other crime scenes we make sure that we have everything that we collected.

MR. GOLDBERG: What did you do with the various coin envelopes that you had with the biological evidence of them--in them?

MS. MAZZOLA: They were put in a small paper bag.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you recall whether they were lying down or standing up?

MS. MAZZOLA: They were standing up.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what was done with the paper bag?

MS. MAZZOLA: The paper bag was put into the back of the crime scene truck.

MR. GOLDBERG: Was the crime scene truck locked?

MS. MAZZOLA: All the time.

MR. GOLDBERG: Approximately what time was it that you left the Rockingham location?

MS. MAZZOLA: It was approximately ten o'clock, somewhere around there.

MR. GOLDBERG: Were you wearing gloves during the collection procedure of the biological evidence at Rockingham?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And do you know whether you were wearing the same pair of gloves the whole time?

MS. MAZZOLA: I probably changed gloves. I don't remember how many times, but--

MR. NEUFELD: Objection, your Honor, speculative. She said "I probably," and move to strike the answer.

THE COURT: Strained. Rephrase the question. Excuse me. The jury is to disregard the last answer and question.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you have a practice at a crime scene to wear the same pair of gloves throughout the entire crime scene?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: What is your practice?

MS. MAZZOLA: I change the gloves when they start getting uncomfortable. If I am done possessing an area and I am moving on to a completely separate area, I will change gloves.

MR. GOLDBERG: By the way, just going back for a second to the blood collection procedure, can you--do you ever touch the blood with your gloved hands?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: When you are collecting it?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: What about the swatches?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Is that something that has happened to you by accident where you have touched a bloody swatch with your gloved hands?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, what do you do with the gloves that you are wearing at the time that you leave the Rockingham location? Do you keep them on?

MS. MAZZOLA: No. We take a paper bag which we label "Trash" and any trash that we generate, whether it is used gloves, swabs, chem wipes, anything, goes into this bag and we take it with us.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, after you left the Rockingham location where did you go?

MS. MAZZOLA: We went to Bundy.

MR. GOLDBERG: Approximately what time did you arrive at the Bundy location?

MS. MAZZOLA: 10:15, somewhere around there.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, when you arrived at the Bundy location, from your own independent recollection, what was going on at that location when you arrived?

MS. MAZZOLA: There were a lot of people there. The Coroners were there. It appeared that there were detectives at the scene.

MR. GOLDBERG: From your independent recollection do you recall whether you saw the body of either Nicole Brown or Ronald Goldman?

MS. MAZZOLA: I remember seeing a brief glimpse of Mr. Goldman.

MR. GOLDBERG: Where do you recall him being?

MS. MAZZOLA: He was up on the walkway.

MR. GOLDBERG: Were you playing--paying close attention to what was going on during this period of time?

MS. MAZZOLA: I was trying to look at everything. There was a lot going on at that time.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Do you recall an incident where Mr. Fung took a bag over to Mr. Lange, Detective Lange?

MS. MAZZOLA: I remember Mr. Fung taking a bag up to the area.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Did you know what was going on at that time?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you see what he did with it?

MS. MAZZOLA: Umm, no, I don't.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you ever, from your own independent recollection, recall seeing Nicole Brown at the location with any blanket over here?

MS. MAZZOLA: I don't recall seeing Nicole Brown.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you remember anything about a blanket?

MS. MAZZOLA: I remember seeing a white blanket there.

MR. GOLDBERG: And where do you remember seeing it the first time that you can recall seeing it?

MS. MAZZOLA: It was up on the walkway near the steps.

MR. GOLDBERG: And did you see how it got there?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, I would like to direct your attention to People's 165 for identification, the board showing the Bundy biological evidence.

(Brief pause.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Miss Mazzola, maybe you can step down for a moment just to take a look at this.

MS. MAZZOLA: (Witness complies.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Does this diagram appear to depict the Bundy location?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, it does.

MR. GOLDBERG: And do the photographs appear to depict various items of biological evidence that you and Mr. Fung collected on the 13th?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, with respect to this diagram, I don't think it is on here, but do you recall the first item of evidence that--biological evidence, rather, that you collected, the first stain?

MS. MAZZOLA: I believe it was on a tree stump. I don't see it on the board.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. It is--the photograph isn't there?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: And for what purpose was that collected?

MS. MAZZOLA: That was collected as a reference sample for Mr. Goldman.

MR. GOLDBERG: With respect to the biological evidence in the caged-off area, can you describe for us, in the physical collection procedure, how you and Mr. Fung worked together in collecting that evidence?

MS. MAZZOLA: He was supervising. He was watching me. After we had marked the numbers, they had been photographed, measured, sketched, he watched as I collected the biological.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And do you recall whether he did any of the physical collection with respect to those items in the caged-off area?

MS. MAZZOLA: There--I believe there were a couple of items that he personally collected.

MR. GOLDBERG: From your independent recollection today, do you know which ones those are?

MS. MAZZOLA: No, I don't.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. And did you then begin--which did you do first, the caged-off area or what we referred to as the trail, in terms of collecting biological evidence?

MS. MAZZOLA: The caged-off area.

MR. GOLDBERG: At some later point you began working on the trail?

MS. MAZZOLA: That's correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you recall who did most of the physical swatching on the items on the trail?

MS. MAZZOLA: I did the swatching.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now--

MS. MAZZOLA: The majority.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you recall any stains now, from your independent recollection, that Mr. Fung physically participated in swatching on the trail?

MS. MAZZOLA: Item 112, he picked up a little more blood off of that item than I had picked up, and there was one other item farther down the trail that he picked up. I can't remember which one now.

MR. GOLDBERG: When you said item no. 112, were you looking at the photograph--

MS. MAZZOLA: The photograph, right.

MR. GOLDBERG: That has item no. 47?

MS. MAZZOLA: That's correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And does the call-out line depict the general area where that was located?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, can you specifically tell us, in terms of item or photo number, where this other item was, or is it just a general recollection?

MS. MAZZOLA: It was just a general recollection.

MR. GOLDBERG: Can you tell us anything that stands out in your mind about that other stain or the circumstances surrounding the collection of that stain?

MS. MAZZOLA: Well, I remember that Mr. Fung knelt down and became a little upset because there were several purple berries in the area and he had knelt down on one and had stained his pants, so he was a little upset about that.

MR. GOLDBERG: Is that how you remember that item?

MS. MAZZOLA: That is how I remember that he had picked up one farther down the trail.

THE COURT: Excuse me, counsel. Miss Mazzola, if you would, over the last several questions and answers, you have talked over each other. Miss Mazzola, let Mr. Goldberg finish asking the question. Mr. Goldberg, let her finish answering the question before you start with the next one.

MR. GOLDBERG: Sorry, your Honor. Thank you.

THE COURT: Thank you.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, when you were collecting these items along the trail area, I direct your attention to stain no. 50, that is item no. 115, and then stain no. 51, it is down here in the lower right-hand corner.

MS. MAZZOLA: Okay.

MR. GOLDBERG: That is item no. 116. Do you recall specifically why they--why they were numbered in that order?

MS. MAZZOLA: I do not recall why they were numbered in that order.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Do you--when you were at a scene--when you were at this scene did you make it a practice to number them in some sort of sequence based on the geography of the location?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, with respect to stain no. 52, that is item no. 117, do you recall collecting that stain?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, I do.

MR. GOLDBERG: Is there anything about that stain or the substrate control on that stain that stands out in your memory?

MS. MAZZOLA: What stands out in my memory, because when I went to take the control, a red color, pigment came up on the swatch, and that is the first time that has happened to me, so--it was about the same color as the driveway. That is why it stands out.

MR. GOLDBERG: Other than that, do you recall anything particularly coming up on the control swatches on the other items on the trail?

MS. MAZZOLA: Other than maybe a little dirt, nothing spectacular.

MR. GOLDBERG: But nothing that stood out in your mind?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you recall one way or the other?

MS. MAZZOLA: (no audible response.)

MR. GOLDBERG: I mean, was it something you took a note of?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: So the only one that stood out in your mind, in terms of coming up with something on the control, was no. 52?

MS. MAZZOLA: Correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: Thank you. You can resume your seat.

MS. MAZZOLA: (Witness complies.)

(Brief pause.)

(Discussion held off the record between the Deputy District Attorneys.)

THE COURT: All right. Mr. Goldberg, I would like to take our recess at this point.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay.

THE COURT: All right. Ladies and gentlemen, we are going to take our first recess for the morning. Please remember all of my admonitions to you. Do not discuss the case amongst yourselves, don't form any opinions about the case, don't discuss the matter with anybody else, do not conduct any deliberations until the matter has been submitted to you. We will stand in recess until 10:30. Miss Mazzola, you may step down. You are ordered to return at 10:30. All right. Thank you.

(Recess.)

(The following proceedings were held in open court, out of the presence of the jury:)

THE COURT: All right. Back on the record in the Simpson matter. All parties are again present. Let's have the jury, please.

(The following proceedings were held in open court, in the presence of the jury:)

THE COURT: Thank you, ladies and gentlemen. Please be seated. Let the record reflect that we've now been rejoined by all the members of our jury panel. Miss Andrea Mazzola is on the witness stand undergoing direct examination by Mr. Goldberg. Good morning again, Miss Mazzola.

MS. MAZZOLA: Good morning.

THE COURT: Miss Mazzola, you are reminded that you are still under oath. Mr. Goldberg, you may continue.

MR. GOLDBERG: Thank you, your Honor.

MR. GOLDBERG: We were talking about the substrate controls I believe before we left. Is it necessary--do you always have to collect the substrate control in every situation when you collect a stain using LAPD procedures?

MS. MAZZOLA: If it is possible to collect one, we collect one.

MR. GOLDBERG: Well, when would it not be possible? Can you give us an example?

MS. MAZZOLA: If say the blood covers the entire area, a small piece of stone or wood or whatever, then there would be no surface area to collect a control off of.

MR. GOLDBERG: You mean if there was no uncontaminated area?

MS. MAZZOLA: Correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: I want to ask you a couple questions more about the Griffen hearing before we continue with the Bundy collection, this hearing in August of 1994. When did you first become aware that you were going to testify in that hearing?

MS. MAZZOLA: It was that morning.

MR. GOLDBERG: And how was it you became aware of it?

MS. MAZZOLA: I was already at work in the toxicology section, and I got a phone call from Michelle Kestler, the lab director.

MR. GOLDBERG: Had you ever testified before that as an expert witness in court?

MS. MAZZOLA: In toxicology cases, yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Can you give us an approximation of how many times?

MS. MAZZOLA: Five to seven.

MR. GOLDBERG: And when she told you that you were going to be needed in court, how much time went by between then and when you actually showed up in court?

MS. MAZZOLA: Probably not more than 10 minutes or so.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did she tell you what case it was going to be on?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes. She said the case. So--

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. So you figured it was this?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. And you didn't have any advanced warning before she called that you were going to be testifying?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: When you got to court, what happened?

MS. MAZZOLA: I was led up--well, I should say led down to the ninth floor, and Mr. Matheson was coming out.

MR. GOLDBERG: Hold on for a second. And who is Mr. Matheson?

MS. MAZZOLA: He was the serology supervisor at the time.

MR. GOLDBERG: So he was coming out of where?

MS. MAZZOLA: Out of the courtroom.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what happened?

MS. MAZZOLA: And he asked me if I had my notes, a binder, and I said, "What notes?" So he gave me his binder of notes and I was brought in.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you have any opportunity to review Mr. Matheson's notes before you went into the courtroom?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you know how his binder was organized?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: When you were brought in, were you brought in for the purposes of testifying?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And did you--were you called by the Defense or Prosecution?

MS. MAZZOLA: I was called by the Defense.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you have an opportunity to discuss with the Defense beforehand what questions they were going to be asking you?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Or discuss any aspect of the case with the Prosecution in advance?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: So you were a criminalist I and you're testifying on the Simpson case. You didn't have a chance to speak with the questioner in advance or review your notes. How did you feel?

MR. NEUFELD: Objection, your Honor. Leading.

THE COURT: Sustained. Rephrase the question.

MR. GOLDBERG: How did you feel at that moment in time? Were you nervous?

MS. MAZZOLA: Nervous and thoroughly alone.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And had you had occasion even to think about the case mentally in trying to go through and remember what had happened prior to getting up on the witness stand?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. NEUFELD: Objection, your Honor. Assuming she had an opportunity to.

THE COURT: Overruled. Proceed.

MR. GOLDBERG: Were you regularly thinking about the case prior to then?

MS. MAZZOLA: No, I wasn't.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. Now, at the Griffen hearing, were you asked some questions regarding who collected what at the Bundy location?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: I would like to ask you some questions on page 735 of the transcript, lines 12 through lines 26.

MR. NEUFELD: Just one moment, your Honor. May I have one moment, your Honor?

THE COURT: Certainly.

(Discussion held off the record between Defense counsel.)

MR. NEUFELD: Your Honor, may we approach the bench for a moment, please?

THE COURT: Excuse me. Yes. With the court reporter.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do I need to bring the transcript?

THE COURT: Yes.

(The following proceedings were held at the bench:)

THE COURT: All right. We're over at the sidebar. Mr. Neufeld.

MR. NEUFELD: Your Honor, my concern is, I understand--

THE COURT: Keep your voice down.

MR. NEUFELD: Sorry. I understand it's perfectly proper to try to diminish the sting of Defense argument when presenting these up on direct examination, but I would object to his use of--actually impeaching the witness with prior testimony which is inconsistent with the testimony she just gave on direct examination at this time. I don't believe that's an appropriate thing to be done on direct examination.

THE COURT: Well--

MR. GOLDBERG: In California it is.

THE COURT: Do you have any case authority for that, counsel?

MR. NEUFELD: To be quite honest, that's the law in both the two jurisdictions in which I practice. I'm not familiar with what the law is in California on that particular point.

THE COURT: California would follow the modern and federal law. Any party can impeach any witness including their own.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you have your transcript?

MR. NEUFELD: Can I have an offer of proof what he intends to read?

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you want me to read the--

THE COURT: No. Just tell me the general area.

MR. GOLDBERG: The offer of proof is, she said that she selected all the stains at Bundy, and it's a little bit ambiguous in relationship to what she said here.

MR. NEUFELD: It's not ambiguous. It contradicts it.

THE COURT: Okay. All right. At this point, the objection is overruled.

(The following proceedings were held in open court:)

THE COURT: Thank you, counsel. Proceed.

MR. GOLDBERG: Actually, I'll start on 734, line 27 through 735, line 26.

MR. GOLDBERG: Are you ready counsel? Do you have that?

MR. NEUFELD: What line? I am sorry.

MR. GOLDBERG: 27.

MR. NEUFELD: Thank you.

MR. GOLDBERG: "Question: And which--I am sorry. At Bundy again, were there certain stains that you collected and other stains that were collected by Mr. Fung? "Answer: Yes. "Question: And which bloodstains were collected by Mr. Fung? "Answer: I believe he collected the red stains that were near the shoeprints that were made on the walkway. "Question: Would you please look at your notes and tell me which numbers those are? "Question: And when you say that, you say he collected the actual foot shoeprints where he collected alleged drops that were near the shoeprints? "Answer: He, if I remember correctly, took swatchings of the red stains that were constituting the footprint itself. "Question: Can you tell us which ones those were, please? "Answer: Property items 55 and 56. "Question: And that is it? "Answer: Yes. "Question: All other bloodstains at the Bundy crime scene were collected by you, ma'am? "Answer: Yes." Do you recall that testimony?

MS. MAZZOLA: Somewhat.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And since testifying at this hearing, was there an occasion when you and Dennis Fung went over the crime scene identification checklist again to try to make notations as to who physically collected which items?

MR. NEUFELD: Objection as to hearsay.

THE COURT: Excuse me. Overruled.

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And have you since had an occasion to think about yourself what happened at the scene and who did what?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And did you in fact do, other than on stain 55 and 56, the shoeprints, most of the physical swatching on the other stains?

MS. MAZZOLA: Most of the physical swatching, yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. And since then, have you come up with the two recollections that you testified to on stain 47 and the item with the berry?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, at the time that you testified at this Griffen hearing, did you believe that all of the photographs taken of the bloodstains had rulers in them or scales in them?

MS. MAZZOLA: I believe that they had, yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: What made you think that?

MS. MAZZOLA: Because I had seen the photographer lay down a scale on one of the drops. So I assumed that he was going to do it for all of them.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you since look at the crime--have you since had an opportunity to review the crime scene photographs?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Have you had an opportunity to review the crime scene photographs before testifying at the Griffen hearing?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: And in reviewing the crime scene photographs, did you see a scale in every single one of the photographs?

MS. MAZZOLA: No, I did not.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. I'd like to direct your attention to an exhibit that we've previously marked as Defense 1081.

(Brief pause.)

MR. GOLDBERG: And it's page 2. This is the crime scene identification checklist, your Honor.

THE COURT: All right.

MR. NEUFELD: What's this of?

MR. GOLDBERG: Bundy.

MR. GOLDBERG: Miss Mazzola, do you recognize this to be part of the crime scene identification checklist for Bundy?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And whose handwriting is on that list?

MS. MAZZOLA: Mine.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, do you see the notation that says was this scene--excuse me--"Has this scene been altered. If so, by whom and how"?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you write that question mark in there or did someone else do it?

MS. MAZZOLA: I did.

MR. GOLDBERG: And why did you do that?

MS. MAZZOLA: Because at the time, I did not know if the scene had been altered. It was an assumption that it had because the Coroners were there.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. Now, is it your understanding as a criminalist that you have a responsibility or that the criminalist has a responsibility to make inquiries of anyone in terms of whether the scene was altered?

MS. MAZZOLA: The criminalist really does not do any investigative work.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. But does the criminalist talk to the investigating officer?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: So would the criminalist perhaps ask questions about what happened prior to their arrival on the scene?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: But when you say "Investigative work," what are you talking about when you use that term?

MS. MAZZOLA: Actually talk to the individual people to find out if they personally had moved anything, where they had been.

MR. GOLDBERG: You mean, in terms of a more formal witness interview?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do the criminalists do that at Los Angeles Police Department?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Thank you. Now, I would like to talk about some of the items that were collected in and around the caged-off area at the Bundy location and first the glove. I think it's People's 164.

(Discussion held off the record between the Deputy District Attorneys.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Excuse me. It's 77-a for identification. Your Honor, maybe I can just put a piece of butcher paper down on the little table over there so we can take this out.

MR. GOLDBERG: Miss Mazzola, I would like you to, after putting the gloves on, remove People's 77 and describe what you're doing for the record.

MS. MAZZOLA: Okay. Do you have a knife or--

THE COURT: Do you have a preference?

MS. MAZZOLA: No. Thank you. I'm opening the sealed envelope. I am removing a paper bag and I'm opening the bag and removing the glove.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, do you recognize any of the writing on that paper bag?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Whose writing is that?

MS. MAZZOLA: It looks like most of it is my writing.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And is that the paper bag into which the glove was placed at the Bundy location?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, have you had an opportunity to look at some videotapes showing yourself collecting a glove and also cap at the Bundy location?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Prior to seeing those videotapes, did you have an independent recollection of who collected those items?

MS. MAZZOLA: I knew that I collected most of the items in that area.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you recall specifically who collected the glove prior to viewing the videotape?

MS. MAZZOLA: Specifically, no.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. Did the viewing of the videotape refresh your recollection?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, prior to this crime scene--well, let me back up for a second. When did you actually start taking the criminalistics courses at school, the criminalistics portions of your formal education?

MS. MAZZOLA: Oh, let's see. 1987, 1988, somewhere in there.

MR. GOLDBERG: So had you been involved in the forensics science community then for approximately six years or so prior to collecting this glove?

MR. NEUFELD: Objection. Leading.

THE COURT: Sustained. Rephrase the question.

MR. GOLDBERG: How long have you been involved in the scientific community prior to collecting this glove?

MS. MAZZOLA: I had contact with them since beginning my forensics courses at school.

MR. GOLDBERG: And that was how many years?

MS. MAZZOLA: Six, seven, somewhere around there.

MR. NEUFELD: Your Honor, object and move to strike. It's totally irrelevant whether she had contact.

THE COURT: Overruled.

MR. GOLDBERG: And can you show us now the technique that is used to collect a piece of evidence such as this glove by placing it back in the bag? I know it's sort of wrinkled, but maybe you can do it for us.

MS. MAZZOLA: Okay. After the photo id number is written on the bag corresponding to the number given the glove, the bag is opened and you want to pick up the glove in a secured grip, but touching as small an area as possible. I'll just put it in and fold the bag closed securely and that's it (Indicating).

MR. GOLDBERG: That's all there is to it?

MS. MAZZOLA: That's all there is to it.

MR. GOLDBERG: And did you feel qualified to do that after being involved in the forensics science community for about six years?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. NEUFELD: Objection, your Honor. Irrelevant whether she felt qualified.

THE COURT: Overruled.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, I would like to show you People's next exhibit, I think it's 78. It's the cap.

MS. MAZZOLA: Yeah.

(Discussion held off the record between the Deputy District Attorney and the witness.)

THE COURT: All right. You want to place that back in the envelope?

(The witness complies.)

THE COURT: Thank you.

MR. GOLDBERG: Can you now retrieve People's 78 for identification and show us what you're doing?

MS. MAZZOLA: Okay. Removing the paper bag from the envelope, opening the bag and retrieving the hat.

(Discussion held off the record between the Deputy District Attorneys.)

MR. GOLDBERG: And what is that item?

MS. MAZZOLA: That is a knit watch cap.

MR. GOLDBERG: And who recovered that from the location?

MS. MAZZOLA: I did.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you recognize the writing that's on the packaging?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Whose is that?

MS. MAZZOLA: That's my writing.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. You can replace that, describe what you're doing for the record.

MS. MAZZOLA: Thank you (Witness complies.)

THE COURT: People's 78's been replaced. Mr. Goldberg.

MR. GOLDBERG: Miss Mazzola, does there appear to be any trace evidence or anything that was left on that butcher paper?

MS. MAZZOLA: I don't see anything.

MR. GOLDBERG: Perhaps we can just dispose of it then.

THE COURT: There's a trash can right beside you.

MS. MAZZOLA: Thank you.

THE COURT: Mr. Goldberg.

MR. GOLDBERG: I would like to now show you a videotape we previously marked as Defense 1083 for identification and then I'll ask you some questions about it.

(Brief pause.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Could we have the lights dimmed a little bit? I think we can get better resolution that way.

(At 11:02 A.M., Defendant's exhibit 1083, a videotape was played.)

(At 11:04 A.M., the playing of the videotape was concluded.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Now--

MR. GOLDBERG: Thank you.

MR. GOLDBERG: Miss Mazzola, did Defense 1083 depict you at the crime scene collecting some evidence?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, it does.

MR. GOLDBERG: What were you collecting in that tape?

MS. MAZZOLA: I was collecting the hat and glove at Bundy.

MR. GOLDBERG: And did you change gloves in-between collecting the hat and the glove?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Why not?

MS. MAZZOLA: The hat and the glove at Bundy were touching each other. They were not in two completely separate areas. They were in physical contact with each other.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And when you were at a crime scene and collecting evidence, is it your habit to, if you see something on your gloves or see some blood or trace on your gloves, to change them?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: So the glove and the hat were in close proximity?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, I'd like to show you another exhibit that's been marked as People's 192 for identification and then I would like to ask you some questions about that.

(Brief pause.)

(At 11:05 A.M., People's exhibit 192, a videotape, was played.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. If you can stop for just a second.

MR. GOLDBERG: I would like to direct your attention to the dark area that is in approximately the middle of the screen.

MR. GOLDBERG: And for the record, this is just shortly after Mr. Fung put down an item and then disappeared up the steps. He's no longer depicted in this frame.

THE COURT: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Let's continue. Maybe we can stop for just a second.

MR. GOLDBERG: We've stopped on a card that I think says 103 and it appears to depict part of the glove on the left side of the screen and part of the knit cap on the right side of the screen; is that correct?

MS. MAZZOLA: That's correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: Is this what you were referring to when you were saying they were in close proximity?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And why is that significant?

MS. MAZZOLA: Well, any trace that I think would be moved from one to the other if you hadn't changed gloves and they were not in such close proximity, that would be more of a concern than if they were side by bide like that (Indicating).

MR. GOLDBERG: And is this where they were at the time that you first saw them?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And when you collected them?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Let's continue. Let's stop for a second.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now we have a photograph that has three evidence cards in it. Did you place those evidence cards down or did someone else do it?

MS. MAZZOLA: Someone else.

MR. GOLDBERG: And who was that?

MS. MAZZOLA: Mr. Fung.

MR. GOLDBERG: And does this photograph depict the envelope and the glove and the watch cap--excuse me--the cap after the three evidence cards were placed down?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. Let's continue. Now if we can stop for just a second.

MR. GOLDBERG: Can you see that dark area that I directed your attention to on the first frame that we stopped on?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And now for the record, we're on a frame at the end of this collage that has a crime scene tape across the upper portion of the screen, your Honor.

THE COURT: Yes. It appears to be the step area, appears to be Mr. Fung wearing booties on the second and third steps.

MR. GOLDBERG: Thank you.

(At 11:08 A.M., the playing of the videotape was concluded.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, with respect to the area, the dark area that I directed your attention to, do you know what that was?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Was it the glove?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you ever see the glove in any location while you were at the scene other than as depicted in the still photography you saw?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, I'd like to direct your attention to an item that we've marked as People's 32 for identification and also 191 for identification.

MR. GOLDBERG: May I approach the witness?

THE COURT: You may.

MR. GOLDBERG: I'm showing you People's 32 for identification. Do you recognize what is in this envelope or this plastic baggie rather?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: What is that?

MS. MAZZOLA: That appears to be the envelope that was found at Bundy.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you recognize any of the writing on the packaging?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Whose is that?

MS. MAZZOLA: Some of it is mine.

MR. GOLDBERG: Who wrote item no. 39 on there? Is that your writing?

MS. MAZZOLA: That appears to be my writing.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what about 104?

MS. MAZZOLA: That's mine.

MR. GOLDBERG: Is 104 the photo?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And directing your attention to People's 191 for identification, is this the same type of bag that is used in the Scientific Investigation Division?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. Now, did you package at the scene the eyeglass envelope, the bloody envelope into the packaging material, the paper bag that has the photo id and item number id on it?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: How did you do that?

MS. MAZZOLA: I picked up the envelope wearing gloves in a small relatively clean area and placed it in the bag and folded down the top.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And is the bag that it's placed in appear to be the same type that I've just given you, the fresh one?

MS. MAZZOLA: Just--yeah. Brown paper bag.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, perhaps we can see the clip of the tape that's previously been marked as Defense 1082.

(At 11:12 A.M., Defendant's exhibit 1082, a videotape, was played.)

MR. GOLDBERG: I want you to look--have we already--maybe we can back it up again--very closely at the item that's being passed between yourself and Mr. Fung. Maybe we can just see that again. Do you see that?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

THE COURT: All right. We're stopping at frame 13:24:24.

MR. GOLDBERG: It's a little blurry. Okay. Fine. That's fine. Is that the entire tape?

(The playing of the videotape continued.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you get a chance to take another look at that?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes. I caught a glimpse of it.

MR. GOLDBERG: What?

MS. MAZZOLA: I caught a glimpse of it.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Have you seen this before?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: This footage? And is that item the bloody eyeglass envelope?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Would you hand a bloody eyeglass--a bloody piece of evidence to Mr. Fung?

MR. NEUFELD: Objection. Speculation.

THE COURT: Overruled.

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: If he wasn't wearing gloves?

MS. MAZZOLA: No. Absolutely not.

MR. GOLDBERG: Why not?

MS. MAZZOLA: He wasn't wearing gloves, plus I was the one that was packaging the evidence.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Do you know in what way Mr. Fung and you were working together at this time in terms of the evidence collection in this area? I'm referring to Defense 1082.

MS. MAZZOLA: I was the one that was in the caged-in area picking up the larger items of evidence. Mr. Fung was handing me the bags, taking the bags from me as I was handing them out.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you know--why was it that the two of you didn't work in the cage simultaneously?

MS. MAZZOLA: At that point, there were other pieces of evidence inside that had to be picked up and there was not enough room for both of us to be in there without running the risk of hurting some of the evidence.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. So only one of you was in there?

MS. MAZZOLA: Correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: And that was you?

MS. MAZZOLA: That was me.

MR. GOLDBERG: And why is it that you would not hand an un-gloved criminalist a bloody piece of evidence?

MS. MAZZOLA: I wouldn't hand anybody anything bloody if they were not wearing gloves.

MR. GOLDBERG: But is it for health reasons or--

MS. MAZZOLA: Personal protection, right.

MR. GOLDBERG: What kinds of problems are you now concerned of, about as a criminalist in terms of dealing with biological evidence at a crime scene?

MS. MAZZOLA: Today, we have various types of hepatitis, we have HIV, we have aids, we have all kinds of things that are showing up in biologicals.

MR. GOLDBERG: Are criminalists in general pretty sensitive about the health issues that are involved in collecting biological evidence?

MS. MAZZOLA: Very, very mindful of it.

MR. GOLDBERG: Thank you.

(At 11:15 A.M., the playing of the videotape was concluded.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, do you recall at the Bundy location seeing any stains on a rear gate on the 13th?

MS. MAZZOLA: I honestly don't even remember a rear gate.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Do you remember having a walk-through with a detective at the beginning of your collection procedure?

MS. MAZZOLA: I remember starting on a walk-through, yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you know whether you went all the way back as--well, do you know where the rear gate is now?

MS. MAZZOLA: Now I do, yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: How?

MS. MAZZOLA: From photographs, video.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. When you went through the walk-through, did you go back as far as the rear gate?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did Mr. Fung continue on with the walk-through?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, he did.

MR. GOLDBERG: Without you? Okay. And at the Bundy location, did any of the blood drops on the area that we've referred to as the trail appear to have been stepped in?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Approximately what time did you leave the Bundy location?

MS. MAZZOLA: Oh, it was approximately 3:15 or so, 3 o'clock, 3:15.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. And where did you go after you left?

MS. MAZZOLA: We went back to Rockingham.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you take the crime scene truck?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what would you have done with the gloves that you had been wearing at the Bundy location when you left?

MS. MAZZOLA: They were taken off and put in the trash bag.

MR. GOLDBERG: Before you left, did you do the same evidence inventory procedure that you've described?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And do you have--are you--do you have an independent recollection of exactly where that took place?

MS. MAZZOLA: Not an exact recollection. I have an idea where it took place, but I can't be absolutely positive.

MR. GOLDBERG: Was it outdoors?

MS. MAZZOLA: It was outdoors, yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Can you tell us in terms of being towards the front of the Bundy location? By that, I mean the Bundy side or to the rear towards the alley side?

MS. MAZZOLA: It was up front.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. What time did you return to the Rockingham location?

MS. MAZZOLA: Probably around 3:30 or so.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you have any notes with you that you can use to give us the time that you collected the first item of evidence once you returned to Rockingham in the afternoon?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, I do.

MR. GOLDBERG: Can you tell us? Do you have it memorized or do you need something?

MS. MAZZOLA: I don't have it memorized.

MR. GOLDBERG: Please tell us what you are referring to to give us that information.

MS. MAZZOLA: Okay. I'm referring to the evidence collection sheet.

MR. NEUFELD: Your Honor, I am sorry. I'll object. I would say there has to be a proper foundation laid before she refreshes her recollection. She hasn't done that.

THE COURT: Overruled.

MS. MAZZOLA: Okay. This says 1540.

MR. GOLDBERG: So that's 3:40?

MS. MAZZOLA: 3:40.

MR. GOLDBERG: Was the notation as to the time in your handwriting or Mr. Fung's?

MS. MAZZOLA: My handwriting.

MR. GOLDBERG: And when you made that notation, how did you do it? Did you ask someone or look at your watch or what?

MS. MAZZOLA: I think I just glanced at my watch.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. And this first item was stain no. 11?

MS. MAZZOLA: Correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: Which was on which side of the house?

MS. MAZZOLA: It was on the side of the house near the garage, on that end of the house.

MR. GOLDBERG: That little narrow walkway area?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: And that's outdoors?

MS. MAZZOLA: That's outdoors.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. Now, I would like to direct your attention back to some testimony at the Griffen hearing on page 758. Well, actually 757, line 25 through 758, line 4.

MR. NEUFELD: I'm sorry? What lines?

MR. GOLDBERG: Line 25 and 758 to line 4.

THE COURT: Do you have that, Mr. Neufeld?

MR. NEUFELD: Yes.

THE COURT: All right. Thank you. Proceed.

MR. GOLDBERG: At the Griffen hearing, did you give the following answers to the following questions? "Question: And what time did you get back to Rockingham was it? "Answer: Right around 4 o'clock, somewhere in there. "Question: How do you know it was about 4 o'clock? "Answer: Because of the time that is noted that we collected the sample in the foyer." Do you remember giving that testimony?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. So was this testimony that you got back there at 4 o'clock correct?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: And why did you testify that way?

MS. MAZZOLA: Because I was--just had a chance to glance at the notes as I was testifying.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. Now, I would like to read you another passage that occurred just previously to that on page 757.

MR. GOLDBERG: Counsel, it's lines 12 through 15. 757, 12 through 15.

THE COURT: Proceed.

MR. GOLDBERG: Just previously to that, did you give the following answer to this question? "Question: So as soon as you got back to Rockingham, the first thing that you did was walk inside and lift item no. 12? "Answer: After it was photographed." Do you recall that?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: So was item no. 12 in fact the first item that you collected?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: So why did you think that item no. 12 was the first thing that you collected and that it was at 4 o'clock?

MS. MAZZOLA: Because as I said, I was just going off of the notes. I didn't have time to go through them and refresh my memory and I looked at the wrong line.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you--didn't you see no. 11 at that time when you were testifying at the Griffen hearing and looking over the crime scene identification checklist?

MS. MAZZOLA: I honestly don't remember.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. But based upon the crime scene identification checklist, was item no. 11 in fact the first stain that you collected in the afternoon?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And who did the physical collection on that?

MS. MAZZOLA: I did.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. Now, did you in fact collect a stain no. 12 in the foyer area of Rockingham?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Perhaps we can see People's 169, which is the interior Rockingham map.

(Brief pause.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Can you see this, Miss Mazzola? Directing your attention to the photographs on this exhibit that are labeled with photograph numbers--photograph no. 12 and the call out line, do those depict where this item was collected?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, it does.

MR. GOLDBERG: And this was the first interior item?

MS. MAZZOLA: Correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: And who did the physical collection in terms of the swatching of this item?

MS. MAZZOLA: I did.

MR. GOLDBERG: Was Mr. Fung watching you on this item?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, he was.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. Now, after collecting this item from the foyer area, where did you go in the location?

MS. MAZZOLA: We started making our way upstairs looking as we were going for any items of evidence.

MR. GOLDBERG: So you collected downstairs first before going upstairs?

MS. MAZZOLA: Correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: And when you got upstairs, did you go to the master bedroom area of the house?

MS. MAZZOLA: We did go there.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you see the item that's contained in photographs 13?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, I did.

MR. GOLDBERG: And where were they?

MS. MAZZOLA: They were at the foot of the master bedroom bed.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. And did you also see the item that's depicted in the photographs that are labeled 14?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, I did.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what are you doing in this photograph?

MS. MAZZOLA: That--

MR. GOLDBERG: Photograph that shows you holding a q-tip.

MS. MAZZOLA: That is a simple presumptive test for blood.

MR. GOLDBERG: Is that the phenolphtalein test?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, it is.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, if you look closely at that photograph, in the upper right-hand corner, you can see that there is some clothing on the ground. Can you see that? It's right behind the shower door. No. The one that has you doing the presumptive test.

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: The one that has photograph no. 14.

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you recall how that clothing got there?

MS. MAZZOLA: One of the detectives was looking through the clothing.

MR. GOLDBERG: Was that while you and criminalist Fung were in this master bathroom, master bedroom area?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, it was.

MR. GOLDBERG: And prior to this detective looking at this item, where was the clothing?

MS. MAZZOLA: The clothing was in a clothes hamper. You can't really see that.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. That's fine. You can resume the witness stand.

MS. MAZZOLA: Thank you.

MR. GOLDBERG: So when the detective took the items out of the hamper, did he ever put them back in the hamper that you saw or did he just leave them on the floor?

MS. MAZZOLA: I don't remember if he put them back or not.

MR. GOLDBERG: But he did--but he did take them out and put them on the floor?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. You can take that down.

(Discussion held off the record between the Deputy District Attorneys.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you know how the towels got on the floor?

MS. MAZZOLA: No, I don't.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, after collecting item no. 12, what was the next item number that you collected, that was collected in your presence?

MS. MAZZOLA: May I check my notes?

MR. GOLDBERG: Yes.

(Brief pause.)

MS. MAZZOLA: After item 12, item 13 was picked up.

MR. GOLDBERG: And after item no. 13, what was picked up?

MS. MAZZOLA: Item 14.

MR. GOLDBERG: And who physically collected item no. 13?

MS. MAZZOLA: Mr. Fung.

MR. GOLDBERG: What time was item no. 14 collected?

MS. MAZZOLA: Approximately 1640.

THE COURT: And the record should reflect that Miss Mazzola is referring to her notes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And were you referring to the crime scene identification checklist?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, I was.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, is there a time for 13 on that list or is it just 12 and 14?

MS. MAZZOLA: Just 12 and 14.

MR. GOLDBERG: Your Honor, I would just like to clarify something before I ask my next question.

THE COURT: Yes. At the sidebar with the court reporter, please.

(The following proceedings were held at the bench:)

THE COURT: All right. Mr. Goldberg, what do you need to clarify?

MR. GOLDBERG: Your Honor, I know on 15 and 16, the airline ticket and the baggage claim--

THE COURT: Oh, no, not this again.

MR. GOLDBERG: That's why I wanted to approach, so I can make sure I'm not going to go--we've had testimony there was a 15 and 16 collected at 5 o'clock, but that's it, which from my view, it sort of went beyond the Court's--

MR. SCHECK: What do you want to do? Maybe we won't have any objection. Just tell us what you want to do.

MR. GOLDBERG: I was just going to ask her when 15 and 16 were collected, not ask what they were.

MR. NEUFELD: We have no objection.

THE COURT: Just that one question.

MR. GOLDBERG: I should have brought the transcript up with me, but there's some inconsistent statements she makes regarding when she left the location. She thought it was shortly after 5:00, and it's based on the time of the collection of 15 and 16. There's reference in that transcript to collectively 15 and 16, the airline ticket. My proposal would be simply not to read that, redact that out.

(Discussion held off the record between Defense counsel.)

MR. NEUFELD: Does the transcript--Hank, does the transcript refer to where it was collected from though?

MR. GOLDBERG: Uh-uh. I don't think it does.

MR. NEUFELD: I mean--

MR. GOLDBERG: If it does, if it refers to anything else--

MR. NEUFELD: No. I'm saying it's fine to bring out the location. In fact, just to take care of it now, if you don't bring it out, we will bring it out later on. Just items were collected in the bathroom and items were collected on the bench outside the front door.

THE COURT: Okay. If they have no objection.

MR. GOLDBERG: I don't know. I mean if it wasn't suppressed, it wasn't suppressed. But if it were suppressed, it's suppressed.

THE COURT: No. What happened was, there was an agreement the People were not going to offer it rather than it being suppressed. But the objection has to be made by the Defense to suppress it or otherwise keep it out. If they have no objection, then I assume we can talk about it.

MR. NEUFELD: It's basically our decision--frankly, the way it was brought out on two separate occasions by the People as part of their direct case created an impression upon the jurors now there's something we're trying to hide rather. So it's only under that kind of pressure that we feel compelled to, you know, simply say where those items were.

THE COURT: Keep your voice down. But it's a tactical decision on your part. So if that's your decision, that's fine with me.

MR. SCHECK: In terms of the location and the item numbers.

THE COURT: Right. Location and item numbers. That's correct. And then you intend on going into time and we're agreed you will just read the part that says item 15 and 16, not what they are, correct?

MR. GOLDBERG: Yes. May I just have one moment?

(Discussion held off the record between the Deputy District Attorneys.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay.

THE COURT: Okay. Done.

(The following proceedings were held in open court:)

THE COURT: These are the most educational sidebars so far. All right. Thank you, counsel. Proceed.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Thank you. All right. And was there an item no. 15 and an item no. 16 that were collected? And just answer that yes or no.

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what time were those items collected?

MS. MAZZOLA: I thought at approximately 5 o'clock.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. And that was according to your crime scene identification checklist?

MS. MAZZOLA: Correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: May I just have one moment, your Honor?

THE COURT: Certainly.

(Discussion held off the record between the Deputy District Attorney and Defense counsel.)

MR. GOLDBERG: And can you tell us the location of where, using your crime scene identification checklist, these two items were located, just the location?

MS. MAZZOLA: Correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: First of 15 and then of 16.

MS. MAZZOLA: 15 was collected in a downstairs bathroom trash can, 16 was collected from a bench outside the front door.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, I'd like to show you another tape that we've marked as People's 186 and then I'm going to ask you some questions about it. If you'd take a look at it.

THE COURT: Is this from Rockingham?

MR. GOLDBERG: Yeah. It's the beta tape from Rockingham.

(At 11:37 A.M., People's exhibit 186, a videotape, was played.)

MR. GOLDBERG: If we could just stop for one second. We're at frame 17:11.

MR. GOLDBERG: So if we assume that this is correct, this would be 5:11?

MS. MAZZOLA: Correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: And in this scene, what are you and criminalist Fung doing?

MS. MAZZOLA: We are putting items of evidence in the back of the crime scene truck.

MR. GOLDBERG: And would these be the items of evidence that you had collected in the afternoon at Rockingham?

MS. MAZZOLA: That's correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, are you placing anything in addition to the evidence itself in the truck at this time?

MS. MAZZOLA: Our kits.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what are your kits?

MS. MAZZOLA: They are two cases that contain things we need to pick up evidence, package it at the scene.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do those contain all of your packaging materials?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, they do.

MR. GOLDBERG: And in addition to the bags, the brown paper bags that we've seen, what other kinds of packaging materials do you have?

MS. MAZZOLA: Plastics, bags, coin envelopes of varying sizes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. So at this point in time, those items are being placed in the rear of the crime scene truck?

MS. MAZZOLA: That's correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: And would this have been after you did the inventory for the afternoon items?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you know where physically that inventory took place?

MS. MAZZOLA: I don't know for sure, no.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Let's continue.

THE COURT: All right. Just for the record, that's 17:11 actually and 50 seconds because there's a lot in between.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Thank you, your Honor. If you could just stop for another second. So this is 17:11:57:02 that we're looking at.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you just lock the crime scene truck?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: So at this time, where is all of the evidence that was collected from the morning at Rockingham?

MS. MAZZOLA: In the back of the truck.

MR. GOLDBERG: And all of the evidence that was collected at Bundy?

MS. MAZZOLA: In the back of the truck.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what about the evidence that was collected in the afternoon?

MS. MAZZOLA: In the back of the truck.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Let's continue. If we could stop for just a second. I have another--I have a question.

MR. GOLDBERG: And the crime scene identification checklist that we've been referring to, where is that at this time as you and Mr. Fung are walking away from the--

MS. MAZZOLA: That is also on the back of the truck.

MR. GOLDBERG: Let's continue. Let's stop for a second. We've just stopped at 17:17:10:24.

MR. GOLDBERG: Miss Mazzola, have you had an opportunity to look at this tape before?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, I have.

MR. GOLDBERG: And have you had an opportunity to take a look, a close look at the item that Detective Vannatter is holding in his hands?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: What does that appear to be?

MS. MAZZOLA: It appears to be the gray envelope that--at least in toxicology, that our samples arrive at the lab in, be it urine or blood.

MR. GOLDBERG: You say in toxicology you see these envelopes?

MS. MAZZOLA: Every day.

MR. GOLDBERG: I would just like to show you what we've marked previously as People's 163-h for identification.

MR. GOLDBERG: If I may approach.

THE COURT: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Can you show us the--hold up the envelope of the type that you work with every day in serology--excuse me--in toxicology?

MS. MAZZOLA: It's this one (Indicating).

MR. GOLDBERG: She's referring to the darker of the gray envelopes.

THE COURT: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Thank you. Let's continue. Let's just stop for a moment.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, when you're working with these envelopes in toxicology every day, are these the kinds of envelopes that are used to contain suspects' blood?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Or urine?

MS. MAZZOLA: That's correct.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. Let's continue. Okay. Let's stop for a second. We've just stopped at 17:20:57:02.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, before we stopped, did you see two shots or two segments showing some activity in the foyer area of the Rockingham location?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you know where you were when that was occurring?

MS. MAZZOLA: I was in the living room sitting down.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And did--what was it that appeared to be in Mr. Fung's hands in this videotape?

MS. MAZZOLA: It appeared to be--

MR. NEUFELD: Objection, your Honor, as to what her opinion of what appears in the videotape when she's not even present and her opinion is no better than the jurors.

THE COURT: Overruled.

MS. MAZZOLA: It appears to be an envelope similar to the gray envelope.

MR. GOLDBERG: And at this time, did either you or Mr. Fung have any of the packaging materials that you--from your crime scene truck from the kits?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. NEUFELD: Objection, your Honor. She wasn't present. She can't say what Mr. Fung had.

THE COURT: Overruled.

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

THE COURT: Let me see counsel without the reporter at sidebar, please.

(A conference was held at the bench, not reported.)

(The following proceedings were held in open court:)

THE COURT: Thank you. Thank you, counsel. Proceed.

MR. GOLDBERG: Was there any other item of evidence that you collected or saw being collected after 5:11?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: That was consistent with those shots?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Can we continue now? Let's just stop for a second.

MR. GOLDBERG: Have you had the opportunity to see this portion of the tape where you and Mr. Fung are leaving the location prior to today?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And for the record, we've stopped on 17:42:54:13.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, did you have the opportunity when you looked at this tape to look at the amount of heft or size of whatever is in the plastic bag?

MS. MAZZOLA: After viewing the tapes, yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And was there anything that you collected or was collected in your presence after 5:11 that was consistent with that other than the analyzed evidence envelope?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. NEUFELD: Objection, your Honor.

THE COURT: Foundation?

MR. NEUFELD: First of all, it's a leading question.

THE COURT: Sustained. Rephrase the question. The jury is to disregard the answer.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you collect anything or was anything collected in your presence after 5:11 that was consistent with the size of what was in that envelope--excuse me--bag?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: And when you were carrying the bag out--well, strike that.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Let's continue.

(At 11:50 A.M., the playing of the videotape was concluded.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, you said after the Griffen hearing, you had a conversation with Mr. Fung where you went over to collect--

MR. NEUFELD: Objection as to that he went over and had a conversation.

THE COURT: Overruled. That's already been testified to.

MR. GOLDBERG: --where you went over, what had been collected and who did it?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you remember any conversation about item no. 17, the vial of blood?

MS. MAZZOLA: I honestly can't remember if we had a conversation or not.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did that in your mind appear to be a significant incident, the circumstances surrounding the collection of or the receipt of that item?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Why didn't it seem to be significant?

MS. MAZZOLA: The laboratory receives samples of suspect's blood or urine all the time. It was nothing unusual.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you make it a point when you were getting ready to leave the Rockingham location after 5 o'clock to make a mental note of everything that was happening and the sequence in which it was happening?

MS. MAZZOLA: Not really, no.

MR. GOLDBERG: Or make a mental note of the time that things were happening after 5 o'clock?

MS. MAZZOLA: Not really, no.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you have any idea that those circumstances were going to be raised as issues later on in a case?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: Your Honor, I'd like to read from the Griffen hearing transcript. It's at page 762.

THE COURT: At what line, counsel?

MR. GOLDBERG: It's line 1 on 762 through line 7 on 763.

THE COURT: Mr. Neufeld?

MR. GOLDBERG: I didn't hear what he said.

MR. NEUFELD: I said I'm reading.

THE COURT: He's reading.

MR. GOLDBERG: I want to ask you whether at the Griffen hearing you gave the following answers to the following questions. "Question:" Oh, excuse me. At 761, line 25, where it starts: "Question: And what happened? What time did you finally leave Rockingham for the second time? "Answer: Let me check my notes. Approximately 1700 hours. "Question: That's the time that you left Rockingham approximately? "Answer: Approximately. "Question: Can you just tell me what the source of that approximation is, ma'am? "Answer: From one of the last items that was picked up on our way out. "Question: And which item was that that was the last item picked out? "Answer: It was sample item 16. "Question: And what time was it picked up? "Answer: Approximately 1700 hours.

"Question: And is it your recollection, ma'am, that as soon as you picked up that item, that you and Mr. Fung left the premises? "Answer: It was a little bit after that. "Question: When you say a little bit after, do you mean five minutes or are we talking about as much as half an hour? "Answer: Not as much as half an hour. "Question: So it'd just be a few minutes? "Answer: Yes. "Question: Were you with Mr. Fung the entire time after you picked up that last item at 1700 hours until you departed for your next destination? "Answer: I believe I was. Yes. "Question: And was anything else, was any other evidence collected after that last item before you actually left Rockingham? "Answer: No. "No other item? "Answer: No. "No other items were logged in? "No." Do you remember that testimony?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, why did you testify that you left at approximately 1700 hours at the Griffen hearing?

MS. MAZZOLA: Because that's what I thought the time was after we picked up the last two items that I personally saw.

MR. GOLDBERG: And when you were referring to something at the Griffen hearing, when you testified to that, what were you referring to?

MS. MAZZOLA: As to where I got the time or--

MR. GOLDBERG: Yeah.

MS. MAZZOLA: The crime scene checklist.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And did you look on the crime scene checklist--

MR. GOLDBERG: Perhaps we could have that item. I believe it's 1007. 1107 rather.

(Brief pause.)

MR. GOLDBERG: Taking a look at the crime scene identification checklist, it's 1107, do you recognize this document?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, when was this created? Was this created on the 13th or after the 13th?

MS. MAZZOLA: After the 13th.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. When you were answering the questions at the Griffen hearing as to when you left, did you look at this page?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: And this page indicates that item no. 17 was recovered at 1720?

MS. MAZZOLA: That's what it says, yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Is that your handwriting, the 1720?

MS. MAZZOLA: The 1720 is, yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And that's 5:20?

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: So had you looked at this page when you were testifying at the Griffen hearing, would you have testified differently?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what would you have testified to?

MS. MAZZOLA: That we--

MR. NEUFELD: Objection as to what she would have testified to.

THE COURT: Sustained.

MR. GOLDBERG: Objection as to what?

THE COURT: Speculation. Sustained.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now--now, as to the question that you were asked at the Griffen hearing about your recollection, that as soon as you picked up that item, that you and Mr. Fung left the premises, when you say you think it was a little bit after that, what was that recollection based on?

MS. MAZZOLA: Which item are you--

MR. GOLDBERG: You were asked whether you left after you collected 15 and 16, and you said it was a little bit after that.

MS. MAZZOLA: Right.

MR. GOLDBERG: What was that recollection based on?

MS. MAZZOLA: The fact that Mr. Fung spent some time talking to the detectives. So it would have been after that.

MR. GOLDBERG: What were you doing in that interval between the time that you got back to the location after locking everything in your crime scene truck and when you came out with the plastic bag?

MS. MAZZOLA: For a short time, I was with Mr. Fung and the detectives and the photographer. After a while, the photographer and I went into the living room and sat down.

MR. GOLDBERG: And what was your mental state at that time?

MS. MAZZOLA: Exhaustion.

MR. GOLDBERG: Did you have a clear sense of how much time was going by when you were sitting down on the couch?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: And when you testified that you believed--when you were asked whether you were with Mr. Fung the entire time between 1700 hours until you departed and you said that you believed that you were, what was the basis of that belief?

MS. MAZZOLA: It was--felt like a few minutes. Didn't feel like a long time at all.

MR. GOLDBERG: Now, were any other items logged in on the 13th after 15 and 16?

MS. MAZZOLA: As to having been received on the 13th?

MR. GOLDBERG: In other words, on the 13th, did you or Mr. Fung in your presence make any paperwork on the crime scene identification checklist, logging in any item after 16?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: And that was done on the 14th?

MS. MAZZOLA: I believe so, yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. And why was it that that was done on the 14th?

MS. MAZZOLA: Because our checklist was locked in the back of the truck. After we were done and ready to leave Rockingham, we had to get back to the lab to prepare the other evidence.

MR. GOLDBERG: At some point after leaving the location for the last time on the 13th, did Mr. Fung say anything to you regarding a vial of blood from the Defendant?

MR. NEUFELD: Objection, your Honor.

THE COURT: Sustained.

MR. GOLDBERG: Is that hearsay?

THE COURT: Yes, it is.

MR. GOLDBERG: Fine.

THE COURT: Why don't we take our noon recess at this time. Ladies and gentlemen, we're going to take our recess for the lunch hour. Please remember my admonitions to you; don't discuss the case amongst yourselves, don't form any opinions about the case, don't conduct any deliberations until the matter has been submitted to you, do not allow anybody to communicate with you with regard to the case. We'll stand in recess until 1:30. Miss Mazzola, you may step down. You are ordered to return at 1:30. All right. Thank you.

(At 12:00 P.M., the noon recess was taken until 1:30 P.M. Of the same day.)

Los Angeles, California; Thursday, April 20, 1995 1:37 P.M.

Department no. 103 Hon. Lance A. Ito, Judge

APPEARANCES: (Appearances as heretofore noted.)

(Janet M. Moxham, CSR no. 4855, official reporter.)

(Christine M. Olson, CSR no. 2378, official reporter.)

(The following proceedings were held in open court, out of the presence of the jury:)

THE COURT: Good afternoon, counsel. Anything we need to discuss before we invite the jurors to rejoin us?

MR. COCHRAN: I just have a question, your Honor, regarding tomorrow.

THE COURT: Yes, sir.

MR. COCHRAN: Are we going to be in session at all tomorrow afternoon under your current plan?

THE COURT: Not in session.

MR. COCHRAN: Okay. I understand. Thank you.

THE COURT: All right. All right. Deputy Magnera, let's have the jurors, please.

(Brief pause.)

(The following proceedings were held in open court, in the presence of the jury:)

THE COURT: All right. Thank you, ladies and gentlemen. Please be seated. All right. Ms. Mazzola, will you retake the witness stand.

Andrea Mazzola, the witness on the stand at the time of the noon recess, resumed the stand and testified further as follows:

THE COURT: The record should reflect that we have been rejoined by all the members of our jury panel. Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen.

THE JURY: Good afternoon.

THE COURT: Miss Andrea Mazzola is again on the witness stand on direct examination by Mr. Goldberg. Good afternoon, Miss Mazzola.

MS. MAZZOLA: Good afternoon.

THE COURT: You are reminded you are still under oath.

MR. GOLDBERG: Thank you. Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen.

THE JURY: Good afternoon.

DIRECT EXAMINATION (RESUMED) BY MR. GOLDBERG

MR. GOLDBERG: We were talking about when you left the Rockingham location and you were explaining why it was that when you went into the vehicle you didn't continue filling out the crime scene identification checklist and I was unclear on that. What was the reason?

MS. MAZZOLA: Because the identification checklist was in the back of the truck.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, when you got back to the laboratory approximately what time did you arrive?

MS. MAZZOLA: Approximately 6:30 or so, somewhere in there, quarter after 6:00.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. And did you fill out the--continue filling out the crime scene identification checklist then?

MS. MAZZOLA: No.

MR. GOLDBERG: What was your priority when you were back at the laboratory?

MS. MAZZOLA: The main priority was to get the swatches which were collected at the scenes to be drying.

MR. GOLDBERG: All right. Now, I will get into that in just a second, but I wanted to ask a few clarifying questions. When you were sitting on the couch at the Rockingham location, before you left, I guess this would have been after 5:11?

MS. MAZZOLA: Uh-huh.

MR. GOLDBERG: Were your eyes opened or closed?

MS. MAZZOLA: I believe they were closed.

MR. GOLDBERG: At what point did you close your eyes?

MS. MAZZOLA: Probably the second I sat down.

MR. GOLDBERG: Do you--did you fall asleep?

MS. MAZZOLA: No, I wasn't asleep.

MR. GOLDBERG: And did you lose track of time when you were sitting on the couch?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes.

MR. GOLDBERG: Were you tired at that point in time?

MS. MAZZOLA: Yes, I was.

MR. GOLDBERG: Why was that?

MS. MAZZOLA: Because we had been up on our feet working constantly for twelve solid hours.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. Now, you said on direct examination, when I was asking you about collecting the glove and the watch cap--the cap, that they were in close proximity or touching.

MS. MAZZOLA: Uh-huh.

MR. GOLDBERG: Which was it?

MS. MAZZOLA: Reviewing photographs, they were in very close proximity to each other.

MR. GOLDBERG: Okay. What was the significance again of them being in close proximity?

MS. MAZZOLA: Well, since they were so close, chances are that any trace evidence would have been on one, the on other. They were not separated by any great distance to preserve trace evidence, just located on one and not the other.

MR.